The Death Penalty

[mmisbg]

Let me first reassert that I hate every team in the Big10 conference, but I'm going to defend one for a minute.

I think it's asinine at the NCAA is considering giving the death penalty to PSU. The crimes committed there are of the worst kind, and those involved should be punished severely. However, from where I stand, the problem there was isolated to a handful of people. One person committed these crimes, and he will hopefully spend the rest of his life in prison. The coach who was mostly responsible for preventing such problems is dead. From there, I see a short list of individuals who should be fired/fined/prosecuted. The problem did not exist at every level, and therefore is not systemic.

I don't see how they can call for the death penalty with PSU when there are programs out there with obvious systemic problems. (before I continue, I will acknowledge that I realize the programs I will allude to did not have the detestable issues PSU did) I don't think I need to name them, but there have been others recently who are clear examples. Their players commit infractions, their coaches enable them, their administrators do nothing more than write letters to the coach, their boosters are involved, and other extraneous members of the club's community are involved.

My question is this: When you don't give the death penalty to a program that has problems at every level, how can you justify issuing it to a program with an isolated problem? (no matter how reprehensible the problem is)

[Falcon Fanatic]

100% agree with you. I think I've read nearly every article on PSU the last few weeks. My first, knee-jerk reaction was like a lot of people's ("throw the book at 'em!"). I've since changed my thinking on that as well. This is the article that changed my thinking: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-215_162-574 ... sky-abuse/

With PSU under the public microscope, the culture of "The Penn State Way" will be changing for the better. PSU will be paying for their previous blind-eye loyalty for years and years to come through the numerous lawsuits that are sure to follow.

[BGFalconfromCincy]

I also agree that Penn State shouldn't get the death penalty, and I don't think the NCAA will give it to them, I don't think they have it in them to do it, plus I would expect the Big 10 to fit it all the way. I believe the punishment should be similar to Baylor basketball after the scandal around one of their players killing a teammate and the coach covering up. Let PSU keep football, but ban them from playing OOC games like what happened to Baylor. I would go even a step farther and make them play all their Big 10 games on the road.

[pdt1081]

My thoughts are that this is entirely a criminal matter. I'm having trouble thinking what the NCAA could hand down as a reasonable punishment. Obviously, anybody with prior knowledge of the events that took place should be criminally removed from the University. Who/what does that leave? It leaves students, faculty, and newly hired administrators that learned of the charges after the initial arrest. How do you punish them for the (in)actions of those that should be in jail?

There is no acceptable (legal) punishment for those that knew and did nothing. Jail time is way to simple and easy. There's no way they will ever see general population. They will sit in their own little area, sleep alone, watch tv alone, shower alone, etc. The only "punishment" will be the restriction of being within the prison walls.

[1987alum]

Don't know if they deserve it or not, but I do know that there is no way in hell the NCAA has the stones to pull the trigger on it.

[Lord_Byron]

I can understand both sides of the argument, and frankly, I think that they need to do a 're-set' on their priorities and the only way to do that is shut down the program from the inside.

Christine Brennan* has a good Column about it today.

*(I know, everything she writes is tainted because she went to Toledo, yadda, yadda)

[MarkL]

Regardless of what the legal system and the NCAA do, I do believe the other 11 Big Ten members need to discuss the issue. Penn State put football above the well being of children and above the university and its mission. The president, athletic director, and head coach all consciously made this decision. Does this go against what all the other institutions stand for? Does this severe misplacement of priorities and apathy to do the right thing merit losing membership in the conference? Not saying it will happen, but I consider the prospect of Penn State being booted from the conference a legitimate possibility.

[mmisbg]

I do not have a problem with issuing the death penalty, booting a team from their conference, etc if the situation is right. However, I can't agree with punishing every member of the club's community when only a small group of them are dirty. Yes, these crimes are the worst kind of crimes, but they are crimes that only a small portion of the organization committed.

To take this further, I'm not even against unfairly punishing those who were not involved, provided that their subset of the club's community has a corrupt element. This brings me back to my earlier point. I don't see how they can justify giving the death penalty in this situation. If the problem existed in more levels of the organization, I could get behind it. However, PSU has too many elements to their community that have absolutely no responsibility in this matter.

[FalconTurf]

I hope that as Paterno and Penn State are sentenced for their crimes in the press and on message boards that all the facts are accurate as these writers have presented. The evidence certainly seems overwhelming but I always feel that each of these individuals deserves their day(s) in court before we convict them with public opinion. Since they have been convicted (by most) it is my hope that they are truly guilty and deserving of their current treatment.

As far as putting the death penalty to Penn State I guess we could take it a step further and ask what role did the Big Variable Conference and the NCAA have in this cover-up? Did they know anything with administrators and coaches that must have had ties to PSU? Maybe if PSU gets the death penalty so should the BIG Y and the NCAA since they monitor and guide PSU. If you are going to punish many for the crimes of few keep the punishment rolling.

[h2oville rocket]

I hope that as Paterno and Penn State are sentenced for their crimes in the press and on message boards that all the facts are accurate as these writers have presented. The evidence certainly seems overwhelming but I always feel that each of these individuals deserves their day(s) in court before we convict them with public opinion. Since they have been convicted (by most) it is my hope that they are truly guilty and deserving of their current treatment.

As far as putting the death penalty to Penn State I guess we could take it a step further and ask what role did the Big Variable Conference and the NCAA have in this cover-up? Did they know anything with administrators and coaches that must have had ties to PSU? Maybe if PSU gets the death penalty so should the BIG Y and the NCAA since they monitor and guide PSU. If you are going to punish many for the crimes of few keep the punishment rolling.

The NCAA makes a living punishing many for the crimes of a few. Any time a school gets punished it affects players, fans, businesses and other entities that had nothing to do with the violation. You don't allow this horror to go unpunished for fear of hurting those people anymore than you go easy on a murderer because his family will suffer with him in jail.

[Falcon Fanatic]

The statue came down this morning:
joe-paterno-statue-removed-and-taken-inside-beaver-stadium-1096098

The President's statement on it:
http://live.psu.edu/story/60474

The Paterno family's statement on it:
http://btn.com/2012/07/22/paterno-famil ... statement/

Also, on Monday, the NCAA is announcing it's "extemely harsh punishments," but no Death Penalty:
http://espn.go.com/college-football/sto ... ource-says

[Flipper]

Penalties are said to be "worse than the death penalty". Typically, the NCAA doesn't punish individuals...it punishes institutions. Penn State failed to exercise proper institutional control over the football team. That is something the NCAA cannot and should not abide by.

[It's the Journey...]

If the reports from ESPN are accurate, this is a scary time to be a college athlete.

To be clear, what Jerry Sandusky did was horrible and the man should and will rot for it. I firmly believe Joe Paterno knew a bit more than he let on. I also believe he is being used a bit much like a scape goat because he is dead. I also believe if you are frying Paterno for covering up what happened along with other university officials then Scott McQuery MUST answer for not going to the authorities as well as Penn State officials. Also, the authorities MUST take some heat for not acting in the 1990's when they had information.

From here, my comments come from the point of view of those in the program right now. If I am a current player, I have not been coached by Jerry Sandusky but I am about to get screwed for what HE did. My team is going to have multiple scholarships taken from it and because it was not given the "Death Penalty" I may have to burn a year of eligibility to transfer. Right now I am probably wishing the NCAA(BS) had shut the whole program down for a year so I can go play for another school and take care of myself. I am also pretty pissed off at the NCAA(BS) because they are supposed to look out for me and my team mates and they are doing anything but.

If I am on the coaching staff I am pissed off because I had nothing to do with what happened here and now I have had my ability to move the program PAST this nightmare taken from me. I did nothing to any kid, I didn't cover anything up, but I am being punished by the NCAA(BS). I am probably talking with my family about breaking my contract, updating my resume, and going elsewhere.

If I am every other school who is a member of the NCAA(BS) I am amazed about what is happening and how. The President of the NCAA(BS) has just penalized a program without sending it through the due process of its own bylaws thanks to "emergency Powers" granted to him. What precident is about to be set? Can this be done to ANY program where felony charges are in play, or only in future cases where sex with a minor (s) is involved? Does this "rapid form of NCAA(BS) justice become a regularly used tool.

There are so many issues to deal with here striking a balance is going to be like trying to balance a granite tile on the pointed end of a nail. While what was done within the football program and upper administration at Penn State was unexcusable, why are those who did nothing wrong except being in the wrong place at the wrong time the ones who will bear the brunt of the punishment? This will change the lives of those members of the Penn State football team, what was their crime?

For me, it is all about holding those responsible accountable. The slope the NCAA(BS) is about to slide down does not do that. To me, collateral damage is unacceptable, there has been enough of that in this case with those who were abused by Jerry Sandusky. I guess I havent' srapped my head around all that has and is about to happen to Penn State and college athletics as a whole. Right now I see a lot of the same reactive punishment that does not punish the true violators.

Only time will tell...

[Lord_Byron]

OK, so I'm going to assume for a minute that I'm the PSU board of trustees and current administration. I know I've hired Louis Freeh to do an investigation and write a report. That investigation began EIGHT MONTHS AGO.

During that time, I do no scenario planning for possible self-sanctions based on potential outcomes of what the report will say. That way, two days after the report comes out, I've got a coherent action plan including communications strategy that allows me to control to some extent what happens to my University.

Instead, I sit for two weeks after the report is released, make no decision on elements as obvious as the statue, and then inexplicably, I wait for someone else to put sanctions on me. Had they self imposed a set of meaningful sanctions and new controls a couple days after the release of the event, the NCAA would have gone away.

Today, on Sportcenter at the dismantling of the statue, they interviewed a woman from the PSU alumni association, who basically said, "This is a PSU problem and everyone needs to keep their nose out it." The ultimate irony of her statement was completely lost on her. That sort of insular, inward focused thinking is what got them in this mess in the first place.

As far as the current players and coaches being in the wrong place at the wrong time, they should get used to it. It happens all the time in business and life. Like the Enron employees who lost their jobs because of criminal actions by their superiors; Employees of a small business whose owner is arrested for tax fraud and the business closes; The aforementioned family with no support because the breadwinner was murdered;

On the transfers and scholarships, we don't have any facts yet on that, so it's too early to comment.

[BGFalconfromCincy]

why are those who did nothing wrong except being in the wrong place at the wrong time the ones who will bear the brunt of the punishment?

The same reason Urban and Broxton Miller are paying for Pryor and Tresell's crimes. The same reason Matt Barkley and Lane Kiffin paided for Reggie Bush and Pete Carroll's crimes. The same reason Scott Drew paid for Dave Bliss' crimes at Baylor. Is it fair, no I agree with that, those still at Penn State did nothing wrong. History tells us though that things do not work out that way