CBI Quarterfinals vs. Stetson (3/22)

[BillyLP]

It is reported that the cost to enter the CBI was $50,000. Moose is doing a really good job of burning that Frack money.

That would be for the ability to host a game in the tournament. If you sell 5,000 tickets at $10 a piece, you would “break even”.

I would hope it would be less this year, but who knows. Terrible.

From asking around I have heard that the entrance fee was significantly lower this year, but that transportation and lodging was completely up to the school, so still not a cheap venture.

Also the Frack gift was an endowment, so it is going to be a set payout in perpetuity. Not saying I agree with how it has been used so far, but it's not like we can just spend the millions all at once on bullshit and then it's gone. It will support the program forever.

[hammb]

It is reported that the cost to enter the CBI was $50,000. Moose is doing a really good job of burning that Frack money.

That would be for the ability to host a game in the tournament. If you sell 5,000 tickets at $10 a piece, you would “break even”.

I would hope it would be less this year, but who knows. Terrible.

From asking around I have heard that the entrance fee was significantly lower this year, but that transportation and lodging was completely up to the school, so still not a cheap venture.

Also the Frack gift was an endowment, so it is going to be a set payout in perpetuity. Not saying I agree with how it has been used so far, but it's not like we can just spend the millions all at once on bullshit and then it's gone. It will support the program forever.

Correct on the endowment. The reporting at the time was that the endowment should provide approximately $675k a year in revenue.

That's not millions by any means, but it's absolutely a good size chunk of cash for a program with a budget such as ours. The most reason budget numbers I can find are from a very interesting article by Mark Smith about how much it costs to invest in hoops enough to gain an at large bid to the NCAA tournament. In his data he has the BG budget at $2.38 million. This was a 2017 number so probably includes the revenue from the endowment, which basically accounts for 28% of our budget.

Given that the money is meant to be IN ADDITION to our normal operating expenses if we deducted that money we'd have the 2nd lowest hoops budget in the MAC, and would be rated about HALF what is required to spend your way to an at large bid.

Interestingly, the endowment DOES put us (by his 2017 numbers) as the 3rd highest basketball expenditures in the MAC behind OU & Akron.

I think this data pretty easily spells out exactly what most of us have been bemoaning. In the case of BG basketball the issue is far more HOW we're spending money then whether or not we do. If we properly spent the money on coaching that actually DESERVED the salaries we're paying and started spending more on a quality schedule this program could absolutely be among the best in the MAC. Instead our administration is content on the status quo which has been non-relevance for 50+ years

[factman]

I’m surprised we didn’t hire ANOTHER administrator just to be in charge of basketball with that money!

[guest44]

Well they have added more paid coaching positions for men's basketball the past few seasons, and multiple college administrators kids to the roster. The Frack money is being used for all kinds of things that don't matter. All the things that really don't matter when you can't identify what a championship coach looks like. For example, taking a senior loaded, underachieving team to Daytona to lose to Stetson without 3 starters in the CBI. The same CBI they chose not to play in back in 2019 when the team had so much momentum the coach got a raise and 3 year contract extension.

https://ohioauditor.gov/auditsearch/Rep ... c4EK0Sz-Ek

Look at the recruiting budget. It sure seems like a team with those kind of recruiting expenses could have found a functional big man.

[hammb]

Well they have added more paid coaching positions for men's basketball the past few seasons, and multiple college administrators kids to the roster. The Frack money is being used for all kinds of things that don't matter. All the things that really don't matter when you can't identify what a championship coach looks like. For example, taking a senior loaded, underachieving team to Daytona to lose to Stetson without 3 starters in the CBI. The same CBI they chose not to play in back in 2019 when the team had so much momentum the coach got a raise and 3 year contract extension.

https://ohioauditor.gov/auditsearch/Rep ... c4EK0Sz-Ek

Look at the recruiting budget. It sure seems like a team with those kind of recruiting expenses could have found a functional big man.

THANK YOU!

I knew I had recently found the budget breakdowns by sport, but couldn't remember WHERE. Thank you Ohio auditor for posting...

The recruiting budget is absurd. Over half the budget that football spends to recruit 25 new scholarship athletes a year...basketball averages what 3-4 new guys a year?

The equipment budget seems absurd as well. $115k in equipment for 12 players? To play BASKETBALL? That's almost $10k per player. For a sport that is played in shorts and jerseys with almost no protective equipment outside of the occasional knee/ankle brace!? How is basketball spending MORE for student athlete meals (12 players) than football (85 players)? How is the "other operating expenses" bucket within $30k for the 12 man basketball team as the 85 man football team?

Our revenue stream for hoops looks healthy if you look at that breakdown. Notice that basketball, and NOT football, actually brings in revenue from the MAC (no surprise). The university is also doing something funky with some other revenue because they list zero revenue for parking or concessions and I can assure you that I myself have contributed far over zero revenue in those buckets. At our current expenses basketball costs the students about $1.2million.

The issue is clearly allocating and spending the money on things that matter. Nothing more than coaching. Huger is at $415k, which is more than Kowalczyk (who has his own issues). But we could bump that up $500-600k and land a truly good MAC coach like Boals or Groce (or Oats prior to his leaving for 'bama). Actually Buffalo is a good case study for how to compensate MAC coaches. They paid handsomely for Oats (and Hurley before him), but Oats earned his raises. He got bumps because the team was successful (ACTUALLY successful). When they moved on and they hired a less sought after candidate in Whitesell, they didn't just hand him the Oats contract, he's making less than Huger, actually. If he has similar success as Oats, no doubt they'll bump him up accordingly, but they didn't just hand him the contract like we gave Huger the Jans contract.

All of it really boils down to the same thing. BG Athletics is piss poorly run. The basketball feels especially poorly run because (through little effort of their own) they have been gifted a golden ticket, and still cannot manage to win. The rest of our sports can cry revenue and expenses, but basketball is spending among the most in the MAC...and still has zero success to show for it.

[TommyG]

I think we may have found our new slogan.....

“BG Athletics!...we are run piss poor (play Falcon screech sound)”

We haven’t had a competent AD since Krebs. Too much emphasis on resume building and not enough on working hard and creating a winning environment. Christopher set the department back a decade with how he structured things. Bunch of administrators and no accountability.

[Falconwriter]

Well they have added more paid coaching positions for men's basketball the past few seasons, and multiple college administrators kids to the roster. The Frack money is being used for all kinds of things that don't matter. All the things that really don't matter when you can't identify what a championship coach looks like. For example, taking a senior loaded, underachieving team to Daytona to lose to Stetson without 3 starters in the CBI. The same CBI they chose not to play in back in 2019 when the team had so much momentum the coach got a raise and 3 year contract extension.

https://ohioauditor.gov/auditsearch/Rep ... c4EK0Sz-Ek

Look at the recruiting budget. It sure seems like a team with those kind of recruiting expenses could have found a functional big man.

THANK YOU!

I knew I had recently found the budget breakdowns by sport, but couldn't remember WHERE. Thank you Ohio auditor for posting...

The recruiting budget is absurd. Over half the budget that football spends to recruit 25 new scholarship athletes a year...basketball averages what 3-4 new guys a year?

The equipment budget seems absurd as well. $115k in equipment for 12 players? To play BASKETBALL? That's almost $10k per player. For a sport that is played in shorts and jerseys with almost no protective equipment outside of the occasional knee/ankle brace!? How is basketball spending MORE for student athlete meals (12 players) than football (85 players)? How is the "other operating expenses" bucket within $30k for the 12 man basketball team as the 85 man football team?

Our revenue stream for hoops looks healthy if you look at that breakdown. Notice that basketball, and NOT football, actually brings in revenue from the MAC (no surprise). The university is also doing something funky with some other revenue because they list zero revenue for parking or concessions and I can assure you that I myself have contributed far over zero revenue in those buckets. At our current expenses basketball costs the students about $1.2million.

The issue is clearly allocating and spending the money on things that matter. Nothing more than coaching. Huger is at $415k, which is more than Kowalczyk (who has his own issues). But we could bump that up $500-600k and land a truly good MAC coach like Boals or Groce (or Oats prior to his leaving for 'bama). Actually Buffalo is a good case study for how to compensate MAC coaches. They paid handsomely for Oats (and Hurley before him), but Oats earned his raises. He got bumps because the team was successful (ACTUALLY successful). When they moved on and they hired a less sought after candidate in Whitesell, they didn't just hand him the Oats contract, he's making less than Huger, actually. If he has similar success as Oats, no doubt they'll bump him up accordingly, but they didn't just hand him the contract like we gave Huger the Jans contract.

All of it really boils down to the same thing. BG Athletics is piss poorly run. The basketball feels especially poorly run because (through little effort of their own) they have been gifted a golden ticket, and still cannot manage to win. The rest of our sports can cry revenue and expenses, but basketball is spending among the most in the MAC...and still has zero success to show for it.

I am quoting this simply because it needs to be stated again...and again...and again...and again. Hopefully, some Board of Trustee members (who actually give a damn about such things) will see this and start to demand accountability -- especially where the Frack money is concerned. While I understand BG's desire to hire its own for positions within the athletic department and as coaches, it is not a smart way to operate. Find the best people...full stop. Who gives a crap where they went to school, so long as they can bring success to the program and the university!

[jpfalcon09]

Well they have added more paid coaching positions for men's basketball the past few seasons, and multiple college administrators kids to the roster. The Frack money is being used for all kinds of things that don't matter. All the things that really don't matter when you can't identify what a championship coach looks like. For example, taking a senior loaded, underachieving team to Daytona to lose to Stetson without 3 starters in the CBI. The same CBI they chose not to play in back in 2019 when the team had so much momentum the coach got a raise and 3 year contract extension.

https://ohioauditor.gov/auditsearch/Rep ... c4EK0Sz-Ek

Look at the recruiting budget. It sure seems like a team with those kind of recruiting expenses could have found a functional big man.

THANK YOU!

I knew I had recently found the budget breakdowns by sport, but couldn't remember WHERE. Thank you Ohio auditor for posting...

The recruiting budget is absurd. Over half the budget that football spends to recruit 25 new scholarship athletes a year...basketball averages what 3-4 new guys a year?

The equipment budget seems absurd as well. $115k in equipment for 12 players? To play BASKETBALL? That's almost $10k per player. For a sport that is played in shorts and jerseys with almost no protective equipment outside of the occasional knee/ankle brace!? How is basketball spending MORE for student athlete meals (12 players) than football (85 players)? How is the "other operating expenses" bucket within $30k for the 12 man basketball team as the 85 man football team?

Our revenue stream for hoops looks healthy if you look at that breakdown. Notice that basketball, and NOT football, actually brings in revenue from the MAC (no surprise). The university is also doing something funky with some other revenue because they list zero revenue for parking or concessions and I can assure you that I myself have contributed far over zero revenue in those buckets. At our current expenses basketball costs the students about $1.2million.

The issue is clearly allocating and spending the money on things that matter. Nothing more than coaching. Huger is at $415k, which is more than Kowalczyk (who has his own issues). But we could bump that up $500-600k and land a truly good MAC coach like Boals or Groce (or Oats prior to his leaving for 'bama). Actually Buffalo is a good case study for how to compensate MAC coaches. They paid handsomely for Oats (and Hurley before him), but Oats earned his raises. He got bumps because the team was successful (ACTUALLY successful). When they moved on and they hired a less sought after candidate in Whitesell, they didn't just hand him the Oats contract, he's making less than Huger, actually. If he has similar success as Oats, no doubt they'll bump him up accordingly, but they didn't just hand him the contract like we gave Huger the Jans contract.

All of it really boils down to the same thing. BG Athletics is piss poorly run. The basketball feels especially poorly run because (through little effort of their own) they have been gifted a golden ticket, and still cannot manage to win. The rest of our sports can cry revenue and expenses, but basketball is spending among the most in the MAC...and still has zero success to show for it.

I am quoting this simply because it needs to be stated again...and again...and again...and again. Hopefully, some Board of Trustee members (who actually give a damn about such things) will see this and start to demand accountability -- especially where the Frack money is concerned. While I understand BG's desire to hire its own for positions within the athletic department and as coaches, it is not a smart way to operate. Find the best people...full stop. Who gives a crap where they went to school, so long as they can bring success to the program and the university!

Bingo. Wreaks of nepotism and a good ol' boys network if all BG is concerned with is hiring former Falcons for top athletic positions. Some of us who are invested in the hockey program have had similar feeling about the Eigner hire, he's an alum so he got the job because of that, and BG passed up on better candidates. It's a really concerning trend.

Speaking of which, isn't Moose's contract up soon? Can't say it's a good look that the current AD is potentially in a lame duck year.

[hammb]

Well they have added more paid coaching positions for men's basketball the past few seasons, and multiple college administrators kids to the roster. The Frack money is being used for all kinds of things that don't matter. All the things that really don't matter when you can't identify what a championship coach looks like. For example, taking a senior loaded, underachieving team to Daytona to lose to Stetson without 3 starters in the CBI. The same CBI they chose not to play in back in 2019 when the team had so much momentum the coach got a raise and 3 year contract extension.

https://ohioauditor.gov/auditsearch/Rep ... c4EK0Sz-Ek

Look at the recruiting budget. It sure seems like a team with those kind of recruiting expenses could have found a functional big man.

THANK YOU!

I knew I had recently found the budget breakdowns by sport, but couldn't remember WHERE. Thank you Ohio auditor for posting...

The recruiting budget is absurd. Over half the budget that football spends to recruit 25 new scholarship athletes a year...basketball averages what 3-4 new guys a year?

The equipment budget seems absurd as well. $115k in equipment for 12 players? To play BASKETBALL? That's almost $10k per player. For a sport that is played in shorts and jerseys with almost no protective equipment outside of the occasional knee/ankle brace!? How is basketball spending MORE for student athlete meals (12 players) than football (85 players)? How is the "other operating expenses" bucket within $30k for the 12 man basketball team as the 85 man football team?

Our revenue stream for hoops looks healthy if you look at that breakdown. Notice that basketball, and NOT football, actually brings in revenue from the MAC (no surprise). The university is also doing something funky with some other revenue because they list zero revenue for parking or concessions and I can assure you that I myself have contributed far over zero revenue in those buckets. At our current expenses basketball costs the students about $1.2million.

The issue is clearly allocating and spending the money on things that matter. Nothing more than coaching. Huger is at $415k, which is more than Kowalczyk (who has his own issues). But we could bump that up $500-600k and land a truly good MAC coach like Boals or Groce (or Oats prior to his leaving for 'bama). Actually Buffalo is a good case study for how to compensate MAC coaches. They paid handsomely for Oats (and Hurley before him), but Oats earned his raises. He got bumps because the team was successful (ACTUALLY successful). When they moved on and they hired a less sought after candidate in Whitesell, they didn't just hand him the Oats contract, he's making less than Huger, actually. If he has similar success as Oats, no doubt they'll bump him up accordingly, but they didn't just hand him the contract like we gave Huger the Jans contract.

All of it really boils down to the same thing. BG Athletics is piss poorly run. The basketball feels especially poorly run because (through little effort of their own) they have been gifted a golden ticket, and still cannot manage to win. The rest of our sports can cry revenue and expenses, but basketball is spending among the most in the MAC...and still has zero success to show for it.

I am quoting this simply because it needs to be stated again...and again...and again...and again. Hopefully, some Board of Trustee members (who actually give a damn about such things) will see this and start to demand accountability -- especially where the Frack money is concerned. While I understand BG's desire to hire its own for positions within the athletic department and as coaches, it is not a smart way to operate. Find the best people...full stop. Who gives a crap where they went to school, so long as they can bring success to the program and the university!

Bingo. Wreaks of nepotism and a good ol' boys network if all BG is concerned with is hiring former Falcons for top athletic positions. Some of us who are invested in the hockey program have had similar feeling about the Eigner hire, he's an alum so he got the job because of that, and BG passed up on better candidates. It's a really concerning trend.

Speaking of which, isn't Moose's contract up soon? Can't say it's a good look that the current AD is potentially in a lame duck year.

I'm not even sure we have to think about it real hard. What are the odds that the following is all true:

Our best candidate for Athletic Director happened to play baseball at BGSU?
Our best candidate for basketball coach happened to play basketball at BGSU?
Our best candidate for hockey coach happened to play hockey at BGSU?

It seems that the odds of that all being true are astronomically high.

[factman]

Our BEST candidate for AD did not play baseball.............he played basketball and is now AD at Loyola Chicago who is STILL playing! Good lunch to Steve Watson!

[Schadenfreude]

I'm not even sure we have to think about it real hard. What are the odds that the following is all true:

Our best candidate for Athletic Director happened to play baseball at BGSU?
Our best candidate for basketball coach happened to play basketball at BGSU?
Our best candidate for hockey coach happened to play hockey at BGSU?

It seems that the odds of that all being true are astronomically high.

Nah. Think back to when Moose was hired in 2016. Dino Babers had just left for the ACC two years after Dave Clawson left for the ACC. There was a lot of angst circulating here and elsewhere about trying to keep coaches around for more than a few years. It is reasonable to think hiring a BGSU graduate could help with that.

If two people can do the job and one of them is a BGSU grad, pick the BGSU grad. It makes sense in our situation.

Now, remember, Moose didn't hire Huger and he didn't hire himself. As for Ty Eigner: He was literally in the building helping coach the first successful hockey teams we've ahead around here since Jerry York. So why not give him the top job? That was a very defensible hire.

Now, sure, the hockey season did not end well, but we'll see. Eigner will get chances to redeem himself. Let's see if he can coach up all these youngsters and build past where we have been the past couple of years. It is way too soon to be making rash decisions about a guy like that.

And I don't want to minimize what happened with the men's basketball program. That was disappointing. But big picture, bottom line: Our teams are having more success now than they were when Moose started. This is certainly true on the women's side, where basketball, soccer, and volleyball are championship caliber programs. Hockey bears watching but it seems to be in good shape. Men's soccer is very competitive. Football is a project but that was pretty much true day Moose was hired. Loeffler is on a long leash, and he should be, because football takes time.

Given what's happening on the field, I don't see how any one should be running Moose out of the building unless he's making major screw ups in other areas where we can't really see.

[TommyG]

Nothing personal against the sports mentioned, but if you are basing AD success on 3 women’s sports and a men’s soccer and hockey program that have won nothing for going on 20 years I would suggest you re-examine your criteria.

[pdt1081]

Our best candidate for hockey coach happened to play hockey at BGSU?

It seems that the odds of that all being true are astronomically high.

That one is not a stretch at all. Thinking about it for more than 5 minutes is a waste. BG hockey has a history of producing excellent coaches.

[hammb]

Our best candidate for hockey coach happened to play hockey at BGSU?

It seems that the odds of that all being true are astronomically high.

That one is not a stretch at all. Thinking about it for more than 5 minutes is a waste. BG hockey has a history of producing excellent coaches.

This is actually very true. Not gonna argue otherwise.

I just find out somewhat questionable that the AD and 2 of the top 4 coaching jobs at the University are all alumni. Maybe they're all massively qualified homerun hires. Or maybe a bunch of people took the easy way out knowing it was an easy sell to fans.

[pdt1081]

Our best candidate for hockey coach happened to play hockey at BGSU?

It seems that the odds of that all being true are astronomically high.

That one is not a stretch at all. Thinking about it for more than 5 minutes is a waste. BG hockey has a history of producing excellent coaches.

This is actually very true. Not gonna argue otherwise.

I just find out somewhat questionable that the AD and 2 of the top 4 coaching jobs at the University are all alumni. Maybe they're all massively qualified homerun hires. Or maybe a bunch of people took the easy way out knowing it was an easy sell to fans.

After Christopher and Kingston, I don't think there was much of a choice going with someone who didn't already have ties to the University. Couple years ago I actually worked for one of Moose's teammates from BG. He spoke highly of him at that time.