Ok, I just have to say this...

The Niz · Post by **The Niz** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 6:34 pm

The Browns also have only had one good season since they returned, when the Falcons have that much trouble for that long then you can start calling for someone's head.

NWLB · Post by **NWLB** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 7:17 pm

I get sick of people that try to apply the label of “real fan” based on any particular set of beliefs, attendance records, etc. It is as arrogant as it is insulting at times. There are no pure faiths in sports fandom.

That said, I don't doubt the pain all BGSU fans are feeling this years. Both those fans who feel there are serious issues in the program, and those that can not stand to consider that possibility.

Some mix of the two general sides of this topic will emerge sooner or later. I won't bother articulating my thoughts again, there are plenty of other threads to hijack for that.

But a newer thought I had about this, was that most BGSU alumni and casual fans watch the team from a great distance, literally and figuratively. You see them at alumni events more than games. They might get to one game, maybe per year, but more often every few years. These people are the great majority of the larger BGSU community. One of the core reasons for BGSU's long-time inability to draw more than 13,000 fans on average (over the long term) is due to this specific point. And it is this same group whom you will meet, and lament the Falcons current trials with. These are the same people that will increasingly stay home as the inconsistency and losing continues.

kdog27 · Post by **kdog27** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 7:47 pm

The Niz wrote:The Browns also have only had one good season since they returned, when the Falcons have that much trouble for that long then you can start calling for someone's head.

What do the Browns have to with anything? I do not see the connection. Limping to wins over Buffalo, EMU, and FIU was bad enough. A loss to Temple cannot be tolerated.

There are so many people on here saying how we still may finish 6-6. Big deal. Going 6-6 is not good enough when you have games like EMU, Buffalo, FIU, and Temple which should be automatic victories. We play a weak schedule, 6-6 is not good at all.

bgsufalcon24 · Post by **bgsufalcon24** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 9:38 pm

Jacobs4Heisman wrote:Hammb's got it right.

All those preaching patience, read this carefully, and think back to the last doldrum period for BG football.

Now consider what Hammb said about new NCAA regulations, and what that might mean to turning the program back around.

Now consider the damage that will be done to this program by the time Brandon's contract is up. Still think 300k is too much money?

Yes it is too much money. You honestly want to change coaches at a time where the current players are going to be mostly in their 2nd or 3rd seasons and have to learn a completely new system? I think that would spell short term disaster for the team, because it would take time to get everything in order in a 2007 season in which we could be looking at 9 or 10 wins if we can just get good QB play.

San Diego Falcon · Post by **San Diego Falcon** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 9:53 pm

2007 season in which we could be looking at 9 or 10 wins if we can just get good QB play

Maybe this is the core of the disagreement? Some feel we have young talent that just needs to mature (along with better QB play) and we'll be successful the next 2 years. Others don't see enough reasons to expect us to overcome our inherent deficiencies in order to achieve such results (I'm in this camp).

I say there's a 99% chance Brandon will be here next year, so we'll see who's more correct. I hope it's not me or others who feel like me.

rc_ziggy84 · Post by **rc_ziggy84** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 1:48 am

San Diego Falcon wrote:
2007 season in which we could be looking at 9 or 10 wins if we can just get good QB play
Maybe this is the core of the disagreement? Some feel we have young talent that just needs to mature (along with better QB play) and we'll be successful the next 2 years. Others don't see enough reasons to expect us to overcome our inherent deficiencies in order to achieve such results (I'm in this camp).

I say there's a 99% chance Brandon will be here next year, so we'll see who's more correct. I hope it's not me or others who feel like me.

I'm not sure talent is the real issue here. Comparing our team now, to Urban's teams, there's a small-moderate drop off in talent, but a HUGE drop off in heart & attitude. This comes from the leadership and coaching style and filters down through the players. Urban ruled his teams with fire and intensity. The players either joined him or got out. Brandon on the other hand seems like a Miami student's dad, who will make excuses for the team after embarrassing losses so that his players won't look bad. Whoever said that Brandon's success was due to the veteran players (J5, Magner, Patten, Hewitt, etc..) who still carried Urban's attitude was dead on. Those players led the team more than Brandon did. Until there's a change in attitude on this team we'll see little to no improvement IMO.

Tangent.. I really miss the leadership we saw in these players. I loved to see Magner get in the faces of his teams and get them pumped up. I loved Josh Harris because he was calm and in control in tough times, but let his emotions show during the good times. We need more guys like this to step up, but again, that all comes from above.

Peregrinner · Post by **Peregrinner** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:25 am

rc_ziggy84 wrote:Urban ruled his teams with fire and intensity. The players either joined him or got out. Brandon on the other hand seems like a Miami student's dad, who will make excuses for the team after embarrassing losses so that his players won't look bad.

Honestly, I was thinking about it the other day, and what I'd really like to see is Brandon step up and really let this team know that this sort of play will not be tolerated. I remember this past MLB season when I saw Jim Leyland on TV berating his team for lackluster play even after they won. I think we need coach (or some player who is willing to take the reins) to step up and really challenge this team. No, I don't want individual players called out like we had before, but we need a coach who's willing to walk into a press conference and say "We didn't do a damn thing right tonight, and that's unacceptable. We will drill this team on the fundamentals until they're doing them in their sleep and in classes, because we just cannot go on with this type of play."

Maybe that seems naive to some, but I think having a coach who is willing to admit a shortcoming on his (and the team's) part and really show that he means business about fixing it is the first step to recovering this team. Of course, that requires the coach to actually follow through and step up.