Big East Expansion

[dstubb]

Hate to break it to you Nate, if Temple snubs the BE for the MAC, it will be big news. Toledo, Temple, and WMU have national respect in football. Not sure how you don't think that doesn't draw attention to our league nationally.

[NWLB]

Hate to break it to you Nate, if Temple snubs the BE for the MAC, it will be big news. Toledo, Temple, and WMU have national respect in football. Not sure how you don't think that doesn't draw attention to our league nationally.

You aren't breaking anything to me. If we lose them, we look like the back-water league we are closer to than most want to deal with. The "national attention" is about how the MAC is struggling to survive at all. We are the subject of national "death watches" and editorials about dropping to 1AA, or cutting football entirely. If they stay, the MAC is whoring itself out to a piss-poor operation, and the only one that gains is Temple at best. Yeah, we really benefit from being beaten senseless by a rental team. Tell me how that is somehow worthwhile?

And as for national respect? The MAC doesn't have it, hasn't for years now. These aren't the "giant slayer" days of nearly five and ten years back. WMU, Toledo? They don't have respect, they have hype. They are "almosts" that didn't do anything, but looked suitably "not bad" in losing anyway.

[NWLB]

Let me get this out here though, because I am in a snippy mood, but not intending to direct it to Stubb or anybody.

I get the point, Temple has some kind of "value," though I strongly debate what kind it is. I'm looking at it, and have, from a specific point of view. I think they were and are a bad idea. If they win, they'll leave. If they lose, we look bad having them. If they lose and leave, we look worse. No matter how you cut it, it is as bad as Marshall. Sure, lots of hype sometimes, but in the end, it was "their" hype, not that of the league. And that really did not linger after they left, which they made it clear they would from the start.

They are a waste. We haven't built anything as a conference having them. And frankly I do strongly feel they are grossly overrated in almost every possible way. UMass isn't as bad a mistake, but I still don't know if having them makes sense either, if they are pre-ordained to leave anyway.

There is such a sense of inertia with the MAC these days, I have no doubt every school that might have the means, is figuring out exit options.

I think the roots of worry start with a number of old MAC members whom I've long said are more interested in pumping up the "nobility of the struggle" than actually trying to build something.

[camkru9701]

Temple hasn't done anything to elevate the MAC. I agree that Marshall did elevate this conference because everyone had to get better to compete with them, but not Temple.

[transfer2BGSU]

Let me get this out here though, because I am in a snippy mood, but not intending to direct it to Stubb or anybody.

You need to relax and have a Snickers bar.

[NWLB]

CUSA and MWC are merging to form a 22 team football league.

Big East is inviting Navy, Air Force, UCF, and Boise State.

[footballguy51]

CUSA and MWC are merging to form a 22 team football league.

Big East is inviting Navy, Air Force, UCF, and Boise State.

I hope this is just a rumor and not the truth.

EDIT: I just found it on ESPN.com. The Big East invitation hasn't been accepted as of yet, but the merger sounds like a done deal. The WAC, MAC and Sun Belt are slipping into further obscurity with this move.

[BGSUfalcons]

If, as is the rumor, Houston and SMU also join the Big East, then the merged MWC - Conf. USA isn't very strong. It would be without Boise St, TCU, Air Force, UCF, Houston, and SMU.

[duckunder53]

If UH and SMU leave for the Big East (which looks like they will if they're invited), would the new "Super Conference" (MWC-CUSA) then try to raid the MAC for a team or two? I believe they're trying to build a conference with the thought of being a BCS automatic qualifier. Maybe Toledo, Temple, WMU, or even NIU will be heading in that direction.

[NWLB]

I don't think any MAC team is even on the radar at this point. Like I said, nobody has "respect," they have, at the very most, "hype." And change the year and who has that differs. It doesn't amount to anything.

But I don't know if the Big East has anybody locked. I think they are getting run over by other leagues moving faster. In truth, I don't know how many of the conference changes hold more than a few years. There isn't a lot about a good deal of what is going on, from the Big 12, to the CUSA/MWC merger, to the deterioration of the Big East, that looks like it is a long-term development.

[dstubb]

If UH and SMU leave for the Big East (which looks like they will if they're invited), would the new "Super Conference" (MWC-CUSA) then try to raid the MAC for a team or two? I believe they're trying to build a conference with the thought of being a BCS automatic qualifier. Maybe Toledo, Temple, WMU, or even NIU will be heading in that direction.

They would be stupid to leave for the Big East now. Not sure why BE teams want to travel to Colorado when Army and Navy are in their backyard. However, I would imagine this "Super Conference" will easily get BCS status. Brilliant move by CUSA and MW. They can play in their own geographic areas and play the conference championship on a neutral location. Brilliant.

Is a MAC-Big East merger next? Maybe jettison some non-competitive MAC schools? I think it would be too complicated given the basketball and all-sports angle. I could see Miami, Ohio, Temple, and Toledo leaving for a new Big East once the BE gets rejected and WVA leaves for the Big 12 or SEC.

[NWLB]

If UH and SMU leave for the Big East (which looks like they will if they're invited), would the new "Super Conference" (MWC-CUSA) then try to raid the MAC for a team or two? I believe they're trying to build a conference with the thought of being a BCS automatic qualifier. Maybe Toledo, Temple, WMU, or even NIU will be heading in that direction.

They would be stupid to leave for the Big East now. Not sure why BE teams want to travel to Colorado when Army and Navy are in their backyard. However, I would imagine this "Super Conference" will easily get BCS status. Brilliant move by CUSA and MW. They can play in their own geographic areas and play the conference championship on a neutral location. Brilliant.

Is a MAC-Big East merger next? Maybe jettison some non-competitive MAC schools? I think it would be too complicated given the basketball and all-sports angle. I could see Miami, Ohio, Temple, and Toledo leaving for a new Big East once the BE gets rejected and WVA leaves for the Big 12 or SEC.

I think some teams want out of Big East because it is unbalanced between all-sports and football. I think it is more likely that what is left of the football playing Big East, severs football from the rest of the conference, and does something else. Could the non-BCS worth teams develop some kind of merger with the MAC? I can see that being possible. The MAC is willing to do football only. The lower rung Big East programs don't want to bring all sports. Do I think it is for the best? Not really. But I think most of the basketball focused schools in Big East are more than happy outside of the issues their football playing counterparts deal with.

But I don't see MAC programs winding-up in the Big East.

(which reminds me, somebody memo Marshall and ask how that inevitable rise to the Big East worked for them?)

[BGSUfalcons]

If UH and SMU leave for the Big East (which looks like they will if they're invited), would the new "Super Conference" (MWC-CUSA) then try to raid the MAC for a team or two? I believe they're trying to build a conference with the thought of being a BCS automatic qualifier. Maybe Toledo, Temple, WMU, or even NIU will be heading in that direction.

They would be stupid to leave for the Big East now. Not sure why BE teams want to travel to Colorado when Army and Navy are in their backyard. However, I would imagine this "Super Conference" will easily get BCS status. Brilliant move by CUSA and MW. They can play in their own geographic areas and play the conference championship on a neutral location. Brilliant.

Is a MAC-Big East merger next? Maybe jettison some non-competitive MAC schools? I think it would be too complicated given the basketball and all-sports angle. I could see Miami, Ohio, Temple, and Toledo leaving for a new Big East once the BE gets rejected and WVA leaves for the Big 12 or SEC.

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The Big East would split into east - west divisions as follows:

East: Central Florida, Connecticut, Navy, Rutgers, South Florida, West Virginia
West: Air Force, Boise State, Cincinnati, Houston, Louisville, SMU

The travel wouldn't be that bad.

If the teams above go from CUSA and MWC to the Big East, I doubt that any team in the MAC would want to join the "Super Conference". It wouldn't have a prayer of being BCS AQ.

[HoustonFalcon]

Houston is looking to go to the Big East right now just for the money. They really should be in the Big 12, but Texas is trying to do all they can to keep the Houston market. With A&M leaving for the SEC, they know they will lose some recruits to the Aggies, because kids would much rather play in the SEC than the Big 12. UH is an up and coming team in both football and basketball, and are looking to build a new football stadium, along with renovate the basketball facilities. They are halfway there with the football fund raising, and adding an extra $10 million a year just for being in the Big East will do quite a bit for them. Along with the extra money they will get in ticket sales with the bigger name schools coming to play. And as for basketball, UH is going to have one of the best recruiting classes in the country after they all sign in November, and have a great upside with James Dickey here now. Bring in the Big East basketball schools, and that is really big money in sales compared to what they have now. This will be all about money for UH right now. The hope is, if the Big East does collapse down the road, that they will be in position to go to another BCS conference at that point. UH is a sleeping giant right now. They have great coaches in the major sports, and football is in the top 25 right now, with a great chance to go undefeated this year. SMU would be another just to get the money. Remember, before both SMU and UH were snubbed when the Big 12 was formed, they were both really good in the SWC. Well, SMU was until they got the death penalty, but UH was until the end of the SWC. I didn't realize how much politics were played when the Big 12 was formed. UH people are still not happy at how Baylor and Texas Tech were included, and UH wasn't. SMU only has themselves to blame.

[dstubb]

Houston is looking to go to the Big East right now just for the money. They really should be in the Big 12, but Texas is trying to do all they can to keep the Houston market. With A&M leaving for the SEC, they know they will lose some recruits to the Aggies, because kids would much rather play in the SEC than the Big 12. UH is an up and coming team in both football and basketball, and are looking to build a new football stadium, along with renovate the basketball facilities. They are halfway there with the football fund raising, and adding an extra $10 million a year just for being in the Big East will do quite a bit for them. Along with the extra money they will get in ticket sales with the bigger name schools coming to play. And as for basketball, UH is going to have one of the best recruiting classes in the country after they all sign in November, and have a great upside with James Dickey here now. Bring in the Big East basketball schools, and that is really big money in sales compared to what they have now. This will be all about money for UH right now. The hope is, if the Big East does collapse down the road, that they will be in position to go to another BCS conference at that point. UH is a sleeping giant right now. They have great coaches in the major sports, and football is in the top 25 right now, with a great chance to go undefeated this year. SMU would be another just to get the money. Remember, before both SMU and UH were snubbed when the Big 12 was formed, they were both really good in the SWC. Well, SMU was until they got the death penalty, but UH was until the end of the SWC. I didn't realize how much politics were played when the Big 12 was formed. UH people are still not happy at how Baylor and Texas Tech were included, and UH wasn't. SMU only has themselves to blame.

If there was any sanity in the world...SMU and Houston would be invited to the Big 12 as the 11th and 12th team. It's completely ridiculous that Texas holds so much power in that conference. Everyone else should leave an form a new conference and f*** Texas until they learn how to play nicely with others.