I have to say it, it bothers me...SEBO

[kdog27]

Thoughts on moving the Toledo Game
1. having the game early on in the season would draw more people, esp your more Fair Weather Fans,

Then we have a late season game that nobody wants to go to. A good example would be the EMU game in 2000. Or the Kent st. game in 2002. The stadium was virtually empty for those games.

[Schadenfreude]

Regardless of records, the BG/UT is the game to watch every single year it seems. It should be kept where it has been the last couple of years on the Tuesday before Thanksgiving Break where it has the best chance of students and alumni to be there as well as receive National Attention.

I would prefer it the Friday or Saturday after, as we did in '03. It's much easier to get there for those of us with jobs.

But I imagine it comes down to getting a good television window and not putting it too close to the MAC title game. We only had five days to prepare in '03.

[Strouse]

Regardless of records, the BG/UT is the game to watch every single year it seems. It should be kept where it has been the last couple of years on the Tuesday before Thanksgiving Break where it has the best chance of students and alumni to be there as well as receive National Attention.

I would prefer it the Friday or Saturday after, as we did in '03. It's much easier to get there for those of us with jobs.

But I imagine it comes down to getting a good television window and not putting it too close to the MAC title game. We only had five days to prepare in '03.

Good point Schade, but if it were the Friday or Saturday after, you would definately lose out on those students who would normally have shown up due to Vacations and such.

[It's the Journey...]

Friday or Saturday would not work because the residence halls are closed. There would be no students close to come to the game. The Tuesday night game is perfect because the halls don't close until Wednesday. Having the game on Tuesday allows the marching band and other student groups who participate in the games to be there without finding temporary housing. It does suck for thos traveling long distances, but there is room for alumni chapters close to sponsor busses and the like to help with that.

[TG1996]

Just don't push it to Wednesday next year, that's all my selfish little self asks!

[Schadenfreude]

Friday or Saturday would not work because the residence halls are closed. There would be no students close to come to the game.

Actually, it has worked. We had a crowd of 30,000-plus for the '03 game on a Saturday afternoon, and somwehere around 27,000 for the '01 game, which I believe was on the Friday night after Thanksgiving.

Last year's game, on a cold Tuesday before, didn't break 20,000.

[CapitalFalcon]

Why does it seem like a bunch of us are just looking for stuff to complain about? The video board isn't big enough. The Sebo is on the wrong side of the field. We don't have enough seating (forget the fact that we have one maybe two sell-outs a year). What the heck? Can't we just be happy that the athletics program appears to be making strides? Granted, this season for football is not on par with the past few but I hope that investments in things like Sebo bring a higher caliber of student athlete.

[Dayons_Den]

Why does it seem like a bunch of us are just looking for stuff to complain about? The video board isn't big enough. The Sebo is on the wrong side of the field. We don't have enough seating (forget the fact that we have one maybe two sell-outs a year). What the heck? Can't we just be happy that the athletics program appears to be making strides? Granted, this season for football is not on par with the past few but I hope that investments in things like Sebo bring a higher caliber of student athlete.

Because by occupying our minds with the goings on in NW Ohio we don't have to think too hard about the goings on in your great city.

[CapitalFalcon]

Why does it seem like a bunch of us are just looking for stuff to complain about? The video board isn't big enough. The Sebo is on the wrong side of the field. We don't have enough seating (forget the fact that we have one maybe two sell-outs a year). What the heck? Can't we just be happy that the athletics program appears to be making strides? Granted, this season for football is not on par with the past few but I hope that investments in things like Sebo bring a higher caliber of student athlete.

Because by occupying our minds with the goings on in NW Ohio we don't have to think too hard about the goings on in your great city.

Touche.

[hammb]

I agree with Schad when it comes to the UT game. Most of us have to work M-W of Thanksgiving week so the Tuesday is still a work night, and we had to work all day, couldn't get there in time to tailgate. It works better for students, yes, but they are at BEST half of our attendance.

For the UT game you are relying on the rivalry and that gets the townies (both BG & UT) psyched for the game. It's a long weekend for almost all of them, and Friday or Saturday are much better options for general fanbase support than a Tuesday night is.

It seems to me like it's a choice between getting great student support or great town/alumni support. While it's fun to cater to the students, I think you get a better overall crowd (and more paying butts) by catering to the town/alumni. As Schad's (albeit small sample size) stats indicate, the post Thanksgiving games have better attendance than the Tuesday game. I know as a local alum, I MUCH preferred the Friday/Saturday game. You could plan out an all day party, the last tailgate of the year and do it with a bang. On Tuesday last year, I had to use vacation time to tailgate, there was a relatively small group of tailgaters for such a big game, and a much smaller in game crowd.

I may be in the minority, but I liked it on black Friday...gave me no reason whatsoever to think about shopping that day

[PGY Tiercel]

I think moving it back might increase attendance due to out-of-towners, like me, returning home for a little Family torture. After spending all day thursday with the family, who wouldn't need to go have a couple of beers and watch a football game.

[Warthog]

I agree that playing on Friday would be better. As it works out now, we are usually playing on Wednesday night the week before. Playing UT on Tuesday means one less day of prepartion. Playing on Friday would give you two extra days over a normal week. At that time of the year, who wouldn't like a couple extra days to prepare/rest?

And like hammb said, most people get Friday off, so it is like a Saturday. You can tailgate all day. Or if you have too, rake leaves, shop, whatever, and still make it to a 4:00 game.

I think one concern has always been that the MAC Champioship game was on Thursday of the following week. If we play UT on Friday and one of us advances to the championship game, then you have the short week again. But isn't the MACC on a Sunday night this year? If that is when the MACC is always going to be, then I see no reason not to play the UT game the Friday after Thanksgiving.

[BGDrew]

What about the players? If the game is played on Tuesday they can go home Wednesday and spend the long weekend (their first of the season) at home with their family for Thanksgiving.

Also, to say that a crowd is "better" with less students is, well, a little out there. Mind explaining that one more hammb?

[hammb]

Also, to say that a crowd is "better" with less students is, well, a little out there. Mind explaining that one more hammb?

By Better I meant "Larger". My thinking is that you sacrifice some student attendance but gain far more locals/alumni attendance by playing the game after Thanksgiving.

I actually think the effect the post-Thanksgiving game has on student support is pretty overstated, too. I was a student for the '01 game and that student section was as packed as you'll ever see it. The '03 game was a packed house as well, I didn't sit in the student section that day, but I'm pretty certain that there were no shortage of students there that day either.

When it comes to football it seems like the students will be there no matter when the game is played...the alumni/townies are the ones that we must cater to, they're the fickle ones.

I certainly in no way meant that the crowd was better behaved or more vocal or anything like that with less students. I was talking purely in terms of attendance numbers.

[It's the Journey...]

I have done some research into the day the UT/BG game was played and here is what I have found.

From 1995 to 1999 the game was played in October. The lowest it pulled was in 1995 when the game was on Saturday, 10/21 and was Homecoming at BG. The attendance was 21,011. The next year at UT on a Wednesday (10/2) 23,918 was in attendance. In 1997 the game was at BG on Saturday, 10/25 and 22,695 watched. The 1998 game was played at UT on Saturday, 10/17 in front of 27.991. And the 1999 game at BG was on Saturday, 10/2 with 23,918 watching. Those are some pretty good numbers for a time when BG was not good at all.

Starting in 2000 the game moved to late November and bounced back and forth between before Thanksgiving and after. Here is a breakdown on some information on the game.

Year Before/After Date Location Attendance Temperature
2000 Before 11/22 UT 26,531 27
2001 After 11/23 BG 26,483 57
2002 After 11/30 UT 25,331 28
2003 After 11/29 BG 29,724 (West) 36
2004 Before 11/23 UT 31,981 (West) 48
2005 Before 11/22 BG 17,438 27

I see three things that jump out at me. In 2003 the winner of the BG/UT game would advance to the MAC title game. We packed the stadium and won. I don't think that would have happened if the game was in October or we played any other MAC school but Miami that year. In 2004 Toledo beat us to go the MAC title game. Another great crowd watched that game. The 2003 game was played the Tuesday before Thanksgiving and the 2004 game was played the Saturday after. Those were great crowds and the games were for more than bragging rights. I am cancelling those two out since they were on opposite sides of Thanksgiving and venues. I would say there is no real proof looking at the numbers that it matters if the game is played before or after Thanksgiving if it were not for last years game. Niether school was in the the title game hunt. We never quite got into a rhythm with all of our injuries. And it was cold.

I think the game needs to stay at the end of the season. The attendance is better with this game is the season finale. That is more true now that the MAC has gotten its head out of its backside and moved BG where we belong in the East. I am not convinced moving the game after Thanksgiving is the way to go either. The fact we are only 30 miles or so from the UT campus should cancel out those who have to travel large distances. There are enough people within a 60 mile radius that follow both schools to fill either stadium twice. To me it comes dwon to what gives us the most potential for student attendance. That is having the game before Thanksgiving when the residence halls are still open and housing is not a problem. So, I want it to always be the Tuesday before Thanksgiving.