Faculty Opinion on Bowl Game

[mscarn]

Flipper and FalconRA are right on. The misinformation, arrogance and intellectual dishonesty is breathtaking. Luckily, they are so radical that they marginalize themselves without anyone else having to.

They always cloak the argument under the noble banners of education and educating students when it really comes down to how much money they themselves are making. They could at least drop the pretentions and make it about what it is: naked self-interest.

[BGWriter]

A couple thoughts based on some posts here...

When I was at BG, the university was already planning to build what is now the student recreation center. The Board of Trustees added a decent amount of money per quarter to the fees of all students, even though most of at the time would never be on campus by the time the facility was built. The whole idea was that we were paying forward, even then, for future students to have something we could only dream was available when we were on campus.

I remember some folks grumbling about having to pay the extra fee, but I don't remember anyone actually working against it or trying to have it removed. We understood that a little sacrifice like that would eventually make the university much better and more appealing, and likely help in the effort to bring better students and athletes to BG in the future.

I don't know how much faculty members are being paid now, but if one of them would like to provide an accurate salary schedule, I'd love to see it. My guess is that, given the amount of time spent working, the working conditions, and the area's cost of living, most of them do very well in comparison to most people in the area who are trying to make a living each day.

In another place on this page I sarcastically wrote a piece about just eliminating all "unnecessary" coursework and making colleges compete against one another for students; and that all government subsidizing of student loans end because it has done nothing but dramatically over-inflate college costs, including the salaries being paid to college professors.

Now while I don't really want to see a world where such cut throat competition is made necessary, we have gotten to the point that universities are being forced to make hard choices about course work being offered and how it relates to an ever-changing economy and workforce. The system as it has existed since I was in school 35 years ago simply can't sustain itself, and changes need to be made. I believe we're seeing that happening, and people are losing their jobs because of it.

But turning down a bowl game as some type of statement (and that's really all it would be in the broad scheme of things) is not going to change what is happening -- and what will continue to happen. That course was coming, regardless. We have a system that simply can't be sustained long-term with students going into debt tens of thousands of dollars to get their degrees, even while getting basic educations, anymore.

[Globetrotter]

A couple thoughts based on some posts here...

When I was at BG, the university was already planning to build what is now the student recreation center. The Board of Trustees added a decent amount of money per quarter to the fees of all students, even though most of at the time would never be on campus by the time the facility was built. The whole idea was that we were paying forward, even then, for future students to have something we could only dream was available when we were on campus.

I remember some folks grumbling about having to pay the extra fee, but I don't remember anyone actually working against it or trying to have it removed. We understood that a little sacrifice like that would eventually make the university much better and more appealing, and likely help in the effort to bring better students and athletes to BG in the future.

I don't know how much faculty members are being paid now, but if one of them would like to provide an accurate salary schedule, I'd love to see it. My guess is that, given the amount of time spent working, the working conditions, and the area's cost of living, most of them do very well in comparison to most people in the area who are trying to make a living each day.

In another place on this page I sarcastically wrote a piece about just eliminating all "unnecessary" coursework and making colleges compete against one another for students; and that all government subsidizing of student loans end because it has done nothing but dramatically over-inflate college costs, including the salaries being paid to college professors.

Now while I don't really want to see a world where such cut throat competition is made necessary, we have gotten to the point that universities are being forced to make hard choices about course work being offered and how it relates to an ever-changing economy and workforce. The system as it has existed since I was in school 35 years ago simply can't sustain itself, and changes need to be made. I believe we're seeing that happening, and people are losing their jobs because of it.

But turning down a bowl game as some type of statement (and that's really all it would be in the broad scheme of things) is not going to change what is happening -- and what will continue to happen. That course was coming, regardless. We have a system that simply can't be sustained long-term with students going into debt tens of thousands of dollars to get their degrees, even while getting basic educations, anymore.

These people work for the state of Ohio. You can see what they make on the treasurers website.

[transfer2BGSU]

These have been provided before, but here they are again

Toledo Blade - http://www.toledobladedata.com/caspio/

Buckeye Institute - www.buckeyeinstitute.org

[Globetrotter]

If I'm a coach and I see this type of thing I might look at the faculty support for athletics as a big negative to accepting this job.

[BGWriter]

These have been provided before, but here they are again

Toledo Blade - http://www.toledobladedata.com/caspio/

Buckeye Institute - http://www.buckeyeinstitute.org

That's all fine, except those are to look up specific people. I'd be more interested in average salaries for a professor in education (as an example) or similar data. It wouldn't have to include names, because I honestly don't care who makes what. I'm just curious what the salary ranges are.

[Falcon137]

If I'm a coach and I see this type of thing I might look at the faculty support for athletics as a big negative to accepting this job.

Vocal minority. There are professors at Alabama, Michigan, Texas that think the football program is ruining their school. Don't let jokers like this professor at BG FIRELANDS make you think this is an issue at BGSU. In my time at BG I probably had 40-50 different professors, deans, etc. that I knew personally and had conversations inside and outside the classroom with. 1 had issue with how much attention / funding athletics received.

[Globetrotter]

Many candidates won't have shared your experience and to them vocal will seem like the norm.

[Falcon137]

Many candidates won't have shared your experience and to them vocal will seem like the norm.

By vocal minority I mean 1 or 2 letter to the editors a year about athletics in general. As opposed to the hundreds of professors and thousands of students that attend sporting events a year. This is a ridiculous argument. Every coach in college football, at every university has met a professor who thinks football and athletics aren't needed and are a waste. This isn't a uniquely BG thing. Hell, Marshall had a basketball player miss a game because the professor was going to flunk him if he wasn't in class the night of the game. And we get worked up because an ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR AT FIRELANDS wrote a letter to the editor.

[Globetrotter]

Many candidates won't have shared your experience and to them vocal will seem like the norm.

This is a ridiculous argument. Every coach in college football, at every university has met a professor who thinks football and athletics aren't needed and are a waste. This isn't a uniquely BG thing. It is unique that some fans here are obsessed with it and think some associate professor at the FIRELANDS campus opinion matters in the grand scheme of things.

I think you are ignoring the context from which this argument was made. ie. Unable to fire coach that needed firing in basketball. Recently started Faculty Union.

This may not have a strong sway on a coach one way or the other but I have worked at and been to enough Universities that I know the budgetary climate and faculty support mean a great deal.

[Falcon137]

Many candidates won't have shared your experience and to them vocal will seem like the norm.

This is a ridiculous argument. Every coach in college football, at every university has met a professor who thinks football and athletics aren't needed and are a waste. This isn't a uniquely BG thing. It is unique that some fans here are obsessed with it and think some associate professor at the FIRELANDS campus opinion matters in the grand scheme of things.

I think you are ignoring the context from which this argument was made. ie. Unable to fire coach that needed firing in basketball. Recently started Faculty Union.

This may not have a strong sway on a coach one way or the other but I have worked at and been to enough Universities that I know the budgetary climate and faculty support mean a great deal.

Again, the majority of the faculty supports athletics. The majority of the faculty knows how important athletics are to a university. You're making it seem like every faculty member wants to be Antioch University. The highest levels of BGSU support athletics and are working to improve athletics. A professor from FIRELANDS, again we are getting worked up about an associate professor from FIRELANDS writing a letter to the editor, that is what people are getting worked up about.

[Globetrotter]

Many candidates won't have shared your experience and to them vocal will seem like the norm.

This is a ridiculous argument. Every coach in college football, at every university has met a professor who thinks football and athletics aren't needed and are a waste. This isn't a uniquely BG thing. It is unique that some fans here are obsessed with it and think some associate professor at the FIRELANDS campus opinion matters in the grand scheme of things.

I think you are ignoring the context from which this argument was made. ie. Unable to fire coach that needed firing in basketball. Recently started Faculty Union.

This may not have a strong sway on a coach one way or the other but I have worked at and been to enough Universities that I know the budgetary climate and faculty support mean a great deal.

Again, the majority of the faculty supports athletics. The majority of the faculty knows how important athletics are to a university. You're making it seem like every faculty member wants to be Antioch University. The highest levels of BGSU support athletics and are working to improve athletics. A professor from FIRELANDS, again we are getting worked up about an associate professor from FIRELANDS writing a letter to the editor, that is what people are getting worked up about.

I'm actually not doing that. A Vocal Minority is what I fear might be doing that.

Reading comprehension is taught at BG. I am certain of it. CERTAIN I tell you.

[Falcon137]

Would somebody tell this guy there is a payout for reaching the bowl game....

There is a payout, but it is very unusual to get the whole payout. As we have talked about in past years, the cost of any unsold tickets come from that payout. I will be surprised is we break even from a money perspective on this game and it doesn't involve major travel for the team.

Last year's bowl did not lose money. Christopher was told not to lose money and he came out and said we didn't lose money. BG may have spent all 1 million dollars of the bowl payout last year. But, they didn't lose money on that deal. Now, San Jose State, probably did. BG is going to sell close to their allotment, granted they will still lose money because of the discounted tickets. Travel is going to be next to nothing, probably 10 buses and then 1 or 2 nights of hotel rooms for the team. That doesn't cost $750,000, which is what the Little Caesar's Bowl pays. Detroit is literally, the least expensive bowl trip BG could make. Also, some of those meals will be paid for by boosters in the form of donations to the program, trust me.

Oh yeah and Wake is handing BG a check for $200 grand for Clawson. So in the span of a few weeks BGSU gets, 950K, a MAC title, 2 games on ESPN with the university's logo broadcast into millions of homes. Countless more hours of their name mentioned on EVERY sports radio station in the country after beating NIU and being in the bowl game. Having highlights from the NIU game shown on ESPN, FoxSports, and CBS Sports, for the past week. And probably an influx of donations, not only from the high end boosters but a little more from the smaller boosters after having a championship season.

I'm done with this topic.

[Falcon137]

Many candidates won't have shared your experience and to them vocal will seem like the norm.

This is a ridiculous argument. Every coach in college football, at every university has met a professor who thinks football and athletics aren't needed and are a waste. This isn't a uniquely BG thing. It is unique that some fans here are obsessed with it and think some associate professor at the FIRELANDS campus opinion matters in the grand scheme of things.

I think you are ignoring the context from which this argument was made. ie. Unable to fire coach that needed firing in basketball. Recently started Faculty Union.

This may not have a strong sway on a coach one way or the other but I have worked at and been to enough Universities that I know the budgetary climate and faculty support mean a great deal.

Again, the majority of the faculty supports athletics. The majority of the faculty knows how important athletics are to a university. You're making it seem like every faculty member wants to be Antioch University. The highest levels of BGSU support athletics and are working to improve athletics. A professor from FIRELANDS, again we are getting worked up about an associate professor from FIRELANDS writing a letter to the editor, that is what people are getting worked up about.

I'm actually not doing that. A Vocal Minority is what I fear might be doing that.

Reading comprehension is taught at BG. I am certain of it. CERTAIN I tell you.

So you really fear candidates are looking at the, letter to the editors from the BG news and thinking, "Boy, not sure I can get the support I need here."? If we were talking other sports at BG, I would agree. The football program pretty much gets whatever it wants. Sebo Center, check. New locker rooms, check. Raises for assistants last year, check. Boosters fund football programs more than any other sport. It's no different here. No matter what the budgetary issues are. Basketball can't buyout the coach because no influential booster stepped forward and wanted to buy out the coach. I don't follow BG basketball much and don't know the ins and outs like football. But, from what I do know, the biggest basketball boosters are actually friends and like Orr. If Clawson had gone, 2-10, 2-10, 2-10 and had a year left on his contract, someone would have written a check for him to be gone.

[mscarn]

If the search is dictated by what's published in the BG News then the candidates are Jerry Glanville, John L. Smith and the former Coastal Carolina coach who meowed like a cat.