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If we're done arguing with and about Dustin, let's move on to the student seating section.

It has been implied by some that students don't deserve better seating since students don't show up to the games. Of course students show up to the games, and I'm sure someone in the Athletics department can prove it if anyone had bothered to ask. They just don't sit in any so-called student section because it's virtually non-existent. As an alumnus, I enjoy sitting among current students, but I do believe if there is to be a reserved student section at Stroh, they deserve better seats than behind the basket.

Did someone suggest that Falcon Club members deserve better seats because they donate more money? Let's do some math.
1. Start at http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/ ... nances.htm, which is the USA Today / NCAA College athletics finance database.
2. Select an academic year. 2009 - 10 is the most recent season available.
3. Select an institution. Bowling Green seems appropriate for this exercise.
4. Click Search.

A chart worth looking at comes up on the screen.
The third line shows that for that for that year $9,497,261.00 came from student fees, and that this was 50.38% of BGSU Athletics income. Rephrased, HALF of Athletics' income came from student fees in 2009-10. I have no reason to believe that's changed.

Shall we break it down a little further?
According to an article in The Sentinel-Tribune, http://www.sent-trib.com/front-page/fre ... enrollment, a combined enrollment of 19,788 was reported for Bowling Green and Firelands campuses.

Basic division shows that $9,497,261 divided by 19,788 students equals $479.95 per student. Rephrased, each student paid just under $480 in fees just to Athletics. What I haven't found yet is how many students had their fees waived, which would mean that paying students paid more per student.

As far as I can tell, in that year, the students paid significantly more than the cost of a Falcon Club membership ($100 minimum donation) and the cost of season tickets for any single sport. (The sports fan who attended all games which sell tickets were the only ones who got a good deal.)

ERGO, I believe students sitting in the student section are NOT getting the best bang for their buck. I believe the students deserve better, especially if they are / were paying half of the total Athletics budget. But, since when did the students come first at BGSU?


BTW, the 2009 - 2010 BGSU Viewbook, found at http://www.bgsufalcons.com/news/2009/5/ ... a_285.aspx, indicates on page 31 that tuition and fees were $9140 that year. I'd love to see THAT broken down.

I think this has already been decided. The student section at the Stroh is behind the one basket and around the corner into sections 101 and 102. I know there are students who come to games. But can anyone know exactly how many? And what percentage of the total crowd? At least at women's basketball games, I suspect the percentage of the crowd is low. I am a season ticket holder in both men's and women's basketball. I can tell you by experience that a lot of students would come up into the chair seats in Anderson and sit where ever they wanted. They didn't care that those were season tickets.

The student fees help fund the entire athletic department not just basketball. Remember there are 18 varsity sports sponsored by BGSU. The students do get sideline/field level seats at football but I do not think they are on the 50 yard line either.

Has anyone done a study as to where students sit at other Universities? I dare say that students do not get prime seats (except at Duke). I watch a lot of games on TV and see students sitting in corners and behind baskets.

It was mentioned that each student pays just under $480 for athletics. Well, as a season ticket holder and Falcon Club member I pay around $380 for each set of tickets (1 each of men's & women's plus Falcon Club). I have 2 tickets for men's and women's basketball. Season tickets, least to men's basketball have been in my family since the 1960's. I suspect some people have season tickets in all 4 major sports at BGSU. That is a lot of money too.

Let's quit this discussion and support our Falcon sports teams. It does no good to keep bringing this up. It just causes hard feeling on both sides.

GO FALCONS. ROLL ALONG.

+1

falconwomenbball wrote: Has anyone done a study as to where students sit at other Universities? I dare say that students do not get prime seats (except at Duke). I watch a lot of games on TV and see students sitting in corners and behind baskets.

I have not done a study, but I have been to every other MAC basketball arena at least once, and from what I remember OU is the only that didn't have the student section behind the basket.

All I know is that, today is my first day back at BG as a student (going back for my Master's), meaning I once again get into games for free, and because of that I don't care where I sit, as long as I have a good time with my friends watching two of my favorite sports, basketball and volleyball. My biggest concern seating wise in the Stroh right now is I gotta decide where I want to sit for volleyball since all seating is GA for that

If you subtract out all those students who get a full ride scholarship (academic or athletic), the $479.95 would actually be higher to those students who pay tuition.

Falconian wrote:If you subtract out all those students who get a full ride scholarship (academic or athletic), the $479.95 would actually be higher to those students who pay tuition.

Not sure about the athletic grant-in-aid but the ACADEMIC scholarships cover tuition only, not fees. So an employees kid who is receiving the tuition waiver is still paying the fees portion.

So for Fall 2011 semester, tuition will be $4,307 (12-18 semester hours) and the student will be responsible for $707 general fees (total of $1,414 for the entire year plus parking, legal services, "green fee", parking permit, etc).

http://www.bgsu.edu/offices/bursar/page25739.html


In addition, a few years back when enrollment dropped by about four hundred students, that was when we revised our scholarship program realizing that we could not sustain it. At that time, we dropped the full tuition grant for a 3.800 GPA and 30 ACT for everyone and now only award 25 such academic scholarships to incoming freshmen. Other colleges and universities have since realized that they could not sustain the outlandish scholarship programs and many have revised how they award scholarships too. BGSU cut its "discount" rate approximately 7%.

transfer2BGSU wrote:

Falconian wrote:If you subtract out all those students who get a full ride scholarship (academic or athletic), the $479.95 would actually be higher to those students who pay tuition.

Not sure about the athletic grant-in-aid but the ACADEMIC scholarships cover tuition only, not fees. So an employees kid who is receiving the tuition waiver is still paying the fees portion.

So for Fall 2011 semester, tuition will be $4,307 (12-18 semester hours) and the student will be responsible for $707 general fees (total of $1,414 for the entire year plus parking, legal services, "green fee", parking permit, etc).

http://www.bgsu.edu/offices/bursar/page25739.html


In addition, a few years back when enrollment dropped by about four hundred students, that was when we revised our scholarship program realizing that we could not sustain it. At that time, we dropped the full tuition grant for a 3.800 GPA and 30 ACT for everyone and now only award 25 such academic scholarships to incoming freshmen. Other colleges and universities have since realized that they could not sustain the outlandish scholarship programs and many have revised how they award scholarships too. BGSU cut its "discount" rate approximately 7%.

My daughter attended the PResident's Day function a few years back and i couldn't believe the scholarship for 30+ on the ACT- there are probably senior classes at some HSs that AVERAGE that. Of course those kids aren't going to BG (or Toledo) but still... not surprised they've scaled that back.

h2oville rocket wrote: My daughter attended the PResident's Day function a few years back and i couldn't believe the scholarship for 30+ on the ACT- there are probably senior classes at some HSs that AVERAGE that. Of course those kids aren't going to BG (or Toledo) but still... not surprised they've scaled that back.

Too many students attending BGSU receiving that scholarship were leaving after a year or so. When asked why? Many stated they only attended for the scholarship. Sad reason for attending. So instead, we redirected those funds down to our "bread-and-butter" students. At that time, our incoming freshman averaged a 3.22 GPA and 22+ ACT composite and received $0 in scholarship. Now the incoming frosh with those stats receives a $1,500 renewable scholarship.

And most definitely there are some senior classes that now "average" that (thanks to grade inflation). I absolutely hate the idea of weighting grades. One district weights an AP A as 6 points, while another gives it only 5 points. Yet another gives the student .5 and fourth says it's worth .25. Good districts realize an "A is an A" and it's worth 4 points regardless. But that is an entirely different rant (err, I mean thread) altogether.

BGFalconfromCincy wrote: I have not done a study, but I have been to every other MAC basketball arena at least once, and from what I remember OU is the only that didn't have the student section behind the basket.

All I know is that, today is my first day back at BG as a student (going back for my Master's), meaning I once again get into games for free, and because of that I don't care where I sit, as long as I have a good time with my friends watching two of my favorite sports, basketball and volleyball. My biggest concern seating wise in the Stroh right now is I gotta decide where I want to sit for volleyball since all seating is GA for that

I haven't done a study either, but I'll be sure to pay more attention. From what I remember, it didn't much matter at other schools because, except for Toledo, our fans usually outnumber the home team fans. (Pat yourselves on the back! We ARE good fans to travel so much and support our Women's Basketball program! )

I've always enjoyed sitting among the students both at home and away, whether on the bleachers, the chairs, or the benches in the back. I remember this past season when a couple of Akron students told "Go BG" Sue that they were graduating and were going to miss her. They said they called her "Mama Falcon".

With regards to getting into games "free", as long as you are paying student fees, your admission to games isn't exactly free. It's more of a pre-paid situation.

Bubba Bo Bob Brain wrote:With regards to getting into games "free", as long as you are paying student fees, your admission to games isn't exactly free. It's more of a pre-paid situation.

I know I know, was just using the term "free" as in I don't have to hand them money for a ticket at the gate or ticket office

transfer2BGSU wrote:

h2oville rocket wrote: My daughter attended the PResident's Day function a few years back and i couldn't believe the scholarship for 30+ on the ACT- there are probably senior classes at some HSs that AVERAGE that. Of course those kids aren't going to BG (or Toledo) but still... not surprised they've scaled that back.

Too many students attending BGSU receiving that scholarship were leaving after a year or so. When asked why? Many stated they only attended for the scholarship.

Gotta be honest, if not for the 3.8/30 full tuition scholarship being in effect, I probably wouldn't have ended up in BG. While I had other reasons for attending (the great people within the Honors Program chief among them) I'd be lying if I said the money wasn't the primary reason.

Leaving never crossed my mind...shocked that the retention rate among scholarship recipients was really low, those students must have never liked BGSU, the city, or its programs in the first place.

bgsufalcon24 wrote: Gotta be honest, if not for the 3.8/30 full tuition scholarship being in effect, I probably wouldn't have ended up in BG. While I had other reasons for attending (the great people within the Honors Program chief among them) I'd be lying if I said the money wasn't the primary reason.

Leaving never crossed my mind...shocked that the retention rate among scholarship recipients was really low, those students must have never liked BGSU, the city, or its programs in the first place.

It is truly amazing the number of parents that I talk to who say "We're going to go to the school that gives us the best financial aid."

When they say that to me, I figure we have given them the best financial aid package and look to the next student. I think BGSU gives out very fair awards, but I am not in the habit of buying students. There have been more than one student that wanted extra money and I only gave them a portion of what they were seeking based upon their financial need and/or high school grades and strength of senior year class schedule (look at the number of students that have to take developmental math and then look to see how many of them did not take a math class their senior year - almost 93%).

I had one mother that was upset when we changed our scholarship program because she had one son here on the full-tuition grant who just met the criteria and another who had higher grades and test scores and was going to receive $5,000 with the opportunity to complete for a full grant. Her comment to me was the son attending BGSU was only here because of the scholarship and if we weren't going to give the second son the full grant, he would go elsewhere. No idea if he ever enrolled, but I am guessing not.

As the transfer counselor, I speak with numerous students seeking to transfer to BGSU that went elsewhere because they were offered a better financial aid package and realized that they made a mistake by going elsewhere. And now when they transfer to the university, they receive no scholarship money (unless they went to an Ohio community/technical college). Some of them give up full tuition scholarships elsewhere to transfer.

Too many people treat the cost of attending college as if they were buying a car. You are not buying a car, you are purchasing an EDUCATION. A car is only going to last you 8-10-maybe15 years. An EDUCATION IS GOING TO LAST YOU A LIFETIME. I'm not spending $40,000 to go to college (but the sticker price for that Chevrolet Suburban I was looking at last week was $41,730). You will finance that car that will last you 8-10-maybe15 years yet complain about the price for an education that is going to last you 40-50-60-or even 70 years if you live long enough.

When I started here in 1979, you had to buy a ticket if you were a student...you could buy an "all sports pass" thatcovered the academic year for 15-20 bucks, but you still had to make a direct, out of pocket payment for the opportunity to see you r fellow students lose to Miami at football.

Tuition back then was $1080...per year!!!! These little bastards today spend more than that on beer....

It's kinda fun being a crankyold guy...

Flipper wrote:When I started here in 1979, you had to buy a ticket if you were a student...you could buy an "all sports pass" thatcovered the academic year for 15-20 bucks, but you still had to make a direct, out of pocket payment for the opportunity to see you r fellow students lose to Miami at football.

Tuition back then was $1080...per year!!!! These little bastards today spend more than that on beer....

It's kinda fun being a crankyold guy...

I remember buying my All Sports Pass for $25. Picking up my tickets on Monday or Tuesday before they went on sale to remainder of the student body (and if you didn't pick up the hockey tickets on Monday or Tuesday, you weren't getting in without buying a regular general admission ticket if you were lucky).

I remember when they raised tuition and fees over 13% for the 1988-89 school year. We ended up paying a whopping $150 more for the school year.