MAC APR Scores

[TG1996]

Who really cares what the Big Ten scores are? We are still in the MAC right?

Believe it or not, some people like multiple teams...

I don't think it's the multiple teams thing here, it's the fact that the schools that got hit with scholarship penalties by and large seem to be mid-major type schools, despite reports that many BCS schools were in bad shape according to previous APR information.

[NWLB]

For those trying to put me down for posting this...........this was purely for informational purposes. I figured you would want to know how the whole MAC stacked up.

I agree that UT has a lot of work to do. But if you don't care to understand that this if for information purposes about all MAC schools and is not to coverup or feel scared about UT, then do us all a favor and don't even read this thread.

Nope...we could care less.

Is that why BG was voted to having the worst fans in the MAC?

Hey, I thought it was for the worst FAN, man, that sucks, I printed a little award sheet and put it on my fridge.

[NWLB]

Who really cares what the Big Ten scores are? We are still in the MAC right?

Believe it or not, some people like multiple teams...

Then it would really great if they asked the question on a Big Ten forum!

[UK Peregrine]

Who really cares what the Big Ten scores are? We are still in the MAC right?

Believe it or not, some people like multiple teams...

Then it would really great if they asked the question on a Big Ten forum!

For comparison purposes, I think it's totally appropriate to ask about the Big Ten teams here so people can get an idea about how they stacked up to the MAC APR scores. Otherwise, how can one even begin to talk about how the non-BCS schools were slighted by this new ratings system.

[Germainfitch1]

Who really cares what the Big Ten scores are? We are still in the MAC right?

Believe it or not, some people like multiple teams...

I don't think it's the multiple teams thing here, it's the fact that the schools that got hit with scholarship penalties by and large seem to be mid-major type schools, despite reports that many BCS schools were in bad shape according to previous APR information.

I hate OSU. This is the reason I asked. I would expect more Football U's to be on the list, instead NONE are on here. None. Just mid majors.

[tekekini]

guess that makes a lot of your points about jocks at BCS schools being dumb and only care about football..

[Bleeding Orange]

guess that makes a lot of your points about jocks at BCS schools being dumb and only care about football..

Will you admit that the results of this report are, at the very least, suspicious?

[tekekini]

guess that makes a lot of your points about jocks at BCS schools being dumb and only care about football..

Will you admit that the results of this report are, at the very least, suspicious?

just wondering why they are suspicious? because they go agaiinst every stereotype that you believe in about the big BCS schools?

maybe they are not suspicious and maybe you need to re-evaluate your beliefs?

[hammb]

guess that makes a lot of your points about jocks at BCS schools being dumb and only care about football..

Will you admit that the results of this report are, at the very least, suspicious?

just wondering why they are suspicious? because they go agaiinst every stereotype that you believe in about the big BCS schools?

maybe they are not suspicious and maybe you need to re-evaluate your beliefs?

I have supported the Buckeyes, and I do not believe that they inherently cheat more than other schools, especially academically.

Even still I find it VERY suspicious that not a single large football program had even one infraction, and the same held true in basketball. I think the big boys do just as good a job as us, maybe slightly better, of keeping their academic stuff in order. I still find it VERY hard to believe that not a single big program had even one infraction worthy of losing a schollie. I'm sorry, that is rather suspicious.

[Schadenfreude]

A point made at one of the MAC boards is that lots of schools had the option of taking this "squad size exemption" -- whatever it is -- and risk facing strong penalities if they can't get their house in order the following year.

It could be that BCS schools, as a group, tended to take that exemption, and that MAC schools decided to suck it up and take their medicine.

I don't know for sure. I need to study how this APR stuff works.

[transfer2BGSU]

guess that makes a lot of your points about jocks at BCS schools being dumb and only care about football..

No, for some reason the NCAA equates leaving college early to try and go pro the same as graduating from college.

From the Columbus Dispatch -

OSU faculty representive John Bruno said the football team’s improvement was helped by OSU winning an appeals process that took into account players who left school early for the NFL.

http://www.dispatch.com/news-story.php? ... A1-02.html


If you don't graduate, then you should count against the APR - no matter the reason.

[FalconAwesome]

Players leaving early for the NFL do not count against the APR number IF they leave the university in good academic standing. If they were not on the proper track when they left, they would count against the number.

Tennessee has appx. 16 people on their academic support staff, including one guy just to make sure the football players are passing. He doesn't even have to deign to work with the walk-ons. They go to somebody else. How can anyone in the MAC compete with that?

A better question is why would you want to? Doesn't there come a point where a kid is kinda responsible for getting his ass to class?

[Goose]

My understanding of the APR scores is that a 925 means that 50% of the current players from your team are "on target" to Graduate. My guess (and this is purely a guess) would be that the disparity you are seeing with the penalties between Mid-Major schools and BCS schools is the result of BCS schools having more resources.

I would imagine that most BCS schools have hired somebody (or at least trained the Academic Advisors for the Athletic Programs) to make sure that their teams meet the 925 minimum score. If they have a player who is close to being on target to graduate (according to some complicated NCAA formula) then they have the player take a few easy courses that count toward Graduation in the Summer to keep them on target, or have them switch to a major where the courses they have taken would put them on target, etc.. With the Mid-Major schools they don't have the resources to concentrate on this, so what you are seeing is likely a more accurate reflection of where the teams stand from an academic perspective.

If the NCAA truly cared about Graduation rates, then they would just take a team's composite Graduation rate over a four or six year period and use that to see if these teams are Graduating their players. Instead they create some ridiculous formula and schools with more resources can hire and train individuals to work through the loopholes to take advantage of it.

I did a quick google search and came up with some evidence supporting my theory. The following chart shows four year graduation rates of football program from '94 to '97:

Long Term Graduation Rates for Football Student-Athletes [I-A Public Institutions]
1. MAC: 83% [10 of 12];
2. Big Ten: 80% [8 of 10];
3. ACC: 63% [5 of 8];
4. C-USA: 50% [4 of 8];
Pacific Ten: 50% [4 of 8];
6. Big 12: 45% [5 of 11];
7. WAC: 44% [4 of 9];
8. Big East: 43% [3 of 7];
9. Mountain West: 33% [2 of 6];
10. SEC: 18% [3 of 11];
11. Sun Belt: 16% [1 of 6].

Based on this data, it doesn't seem like the MAC is the conference with the problem. It is also interesting to note that it doesn't look like the Big Ten has much of a problem either.

[TG1996]

Interesting... according to John Harris, UT's APR woes are ESPN's fault:

http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/ar ... /603030418

[Germainfitch1]

My understanding of the APR scores is that a 925 means that 50% of the current players from your team are "on target" to Graduate. My guess (and this is purely a guess) would be that the disparity you are seeing with the penalties between Mid-Major schools and BCS schools is the result of BCS schools having more resources.

I would imagine that most BCS schools have hired somebody (or at least trained the Academic Advisors for the Athletic Programs) to make sure that their teams meet the 925 minimum score. If they have a player who is close to being on target to graduate (according to some complicated NCAA formula) then they have the player take a few easy courses that count toward Graduation in the Summer to keep them on target, or have them switch to a major where the courses they have taken would put them on target, etc.. With the Mid-Major schools they don't have the resources to concentrate on this, so what you are seeing is likely a more accurate reflection of where the teams stand from an academic perspective.

If the NCAA truly cared about Graduation rates, then they would just take a team's composite Graduation rate over a four or six year period and use that to see if these teams are Graduating their players. Instead they create some ridiculous formula and schools with more resources can hire and train individuals to work through the loopholes to take advantage of it.

I did a quick google search and came up with some evidence supporting my theory. The following chart shows four year graduation rates of football program from '94 to '97:

Long Term Graduation Rates for Football Student-Athletes [I-A Public Institutions]
1. MAC: 83% [10 of 12];
2. Big Ten: 80% [8 of 10];
3. ACC: 63% [5 of 8];
4. C-USA: 50% [4 of 8];
Pacific Ten: 50% [4 of 8];
6. Big 12: 45% [5 of 11];
7. WAC: 44% [4 of 9];
8. Big East: 43% [3 of 7];
9. Mountain West: 33% [2 of 6];
10. SEC: 18% [3 of 11];
11. Sun Belt: 16% [1 of 6].

Based on this data, it doesn't seem like the MAC is the conference with the problem. It is also interesting to note that it doesn't look like the Big Ten has much of a problem either.

I would really like an explanation of this from some one in the know.