Oglesby

[debtzoomba]

This was the second straight game where TO picked up 2 early fouls and then Orr just sits him. Why is this? Who cares if he gets 3 in the first half...we have all kinds of depth inside. He picked up his 3rd foul tonight in the first couple of minutes of the second half and never played again? Play him until he picks up his 3rd foul in the first half. Then play him until he picks up his 4th in the second half and then put him back in with about 5 minutes left. If we can win without him, great for us. It's just a heck of a lot easier with him in the game. No dunks by us tonight, by the way.

[Class of 61]

This was the second straight game where TO picked up 2 early fouls and then Orr just sits him. Why is this? Who cares if he gets 3 in the first half...we have all kinds of depth inside. He picked up his 3rd foul tonight in the first couple of minutes of the second half and never played again? Play him until he picks up his 3rd foul in the first half. Then play him until he picks up his 4th in the second half and then put him back in with about 5 minutes left. If we can win without him, great for us. It's just a heck of a lot easier with him in the game. No dunks by us tonight, by the way.

Debt,
It's pretty much "standard procedure" for a coach to sit a kid with 2 early fouls...happened to Jakubowski in the Akron game...two fouls in the 1st 3 minutes or so...got him a seat on the bench...If you let a guy get 3 in 1st half, you're not leaving yourself any "wiggle room" later in the game as he'll have to play very tentatively when he returns...and if he got that 3rd foul early in 2nd half as you said, you'd prefer that he got his 4th foul instead... last I checked, he picked up his 4th in OT....

[Globetrotter]

I am more confused about Blacks dwindling PT.

[Redwingtom]

We are 6-2, I trust the coach, you should too!

[Globetrotter]

So when we were 1-8 we shouldnt have trusted the coach?

[Matty B]

I am more confused about Blacks dwindling PT.

This team is deep enough to the point where Orr isn't afraid to cut a guy's minutes if he's innefective and raise a guy's minutes when a player's more effective than usual. In this case, Dabney, McElroy and Calhoun have been very effective the past two games and there hasn't been much of a reason to take any of those guys out in favor of Black. The same can be said for Craig Sealey. They're freshmen, they'll get their share of run as time goes on. Don't worry.

[Globetrotter]

I am more confused about Blacks dwindling PT.

This team is deep enough to the point where Orr isn't afraid to cut a guy's minutes if he's innefective and raise a guy's minutes when a player's more effective than usual. In this case, Dabney, McElroy and Calhoun have been very effective the past two games and there hasn't been much of a reason to take any of those guys out in favor of Black. The same can be said for Craig Sealey. They're freshmen, they'll get their share of run as time goes on. Don't worry.

I am more worried about the mindset of a 18 year old that I think can do great things down the road for us. I'm talking Otis Polk as a lower bound.

[hammb]

Psyche of 18 year olds or not I think a college coach has to play the players that are giving him the best minutes. Black looked good early, but he really hasn't been effective in his minutes of late. Moreover, I honestly think his leg is hurting him quite a bit and we're not hearing about an injury. Against Eastern he came out of the game clutching his knee and never returned.

Watching him over the MAC games he looks much slower and lumbering than he was early in the year. He's either worn out physically (which is possible for a freshman), or he's dealing with an injury. Either way we have the depth that we don't have to force him out there when he's not playing as well as these other guys.

I think we, as fans, have a tendency to worry far too much about the mindset of these guys. Any player that is destined to actually be good would be able to realize that he's not playing as well as the guys replacing him and know that if he wants to play more he's gotta get better. Of course if it's injury related, then they should be able to shrug it off pretty easily.

[Globetrotter]

Psyche of 18 year olds or not I think a college coach has to play the players that are giving him the best minutes. Black looked good early, but he really hasn't been effective in his minutes of late. Moreover, I honestly think his leg is hurting him quite a bit and we're not hearing about an injury. Against Eastern he came out of the game clutching his knee and never returned.

Watching him over the MAC games he looks much slower and lumbering than he was early in the year. He's either worn out physically (which is possible for a freshman), or he's dealing with an injury. Either way we have the depth that we don't have to force him out there when he's not playing as well as these other guys.

I think we, as fans, have a tendency to worry far too much about the mindset of these guys. Any player that is destined to actually be good would be able to realize that he's not playing as well as the guys replacing him and know that if he wants to play more he's gotta get better. Of course if it's injury related, then they should be able to shrug it off pretty easily.

I hope you are right about paragraph 1 and 2 but paragraph 3 I disagree with. Their mindsets are fragile, the first thought of almost anyone in this situation would be defensive, "what are they doing to me and why are they against me." Especially true of someone who has so much success in HS and early success in college. Upon deeper reflection he may realize "ok I am not playing great and need to improve ........." Alot of these kids have never daced diversity and don't know how to deal with it.

With all of that said I agree that I would much rather have them play who will ahve us win this year and let the chips fall where they may down the road.

[Redwingtom]

Sorry, but this isn't little league tee ball. You want the coach to play everyone so their feelings don't get hurt? C'mon man! LOL, That makes little to no sense.

[Globetrotter]

Sorry, but this isn't little league tee ball. You want the coach to play everyone so their feelings don't get hurt? C'mon man! LOL, That makes little to no sense.

You dont need to apologize. Ignoring the mindset of an 18 year old kid is not a wise move. I said I was worried about it, I did not say that coach should handle it any other way. I am guessing there is alot going on behind the scenes that we don't know about.

If there is not then it would be a recipe for a kid to become disengaged from the team and want to leave.

[Flipper]

I think presuming that an 18 year old kid has a fragile mindset is kind of odd...besides, I don't think the coach should alter his decisions on PT based on hurt feelings. It's a simple process...contribute to wins or sit. Better to learn that as an 18 year-old freshman than a 22 year-old senior.

[jg4242]

If these kids' egos are really so fragile that they aren't able to put aside short-term, selfish concerns to put the TEAM first, then they aren't likely to be the kind of players that will help this program move forward. Look at what Coach Miller has done with the women. It's a TEAM mentality, where every player, even the star, is secondary to the team. That is how you create a championship program. And that's what Blasi has done at Miami. And what Jon Wooden did at UCLA. And what Krzyzewski has done at Duke.

[Globetrotter]

If these kids' egos are really so fragile that they aren't able to put aside short-term, selfish concerns to put the TEAM first, then they aren't likely to be the kind of players that will help this program move forward. Look at what Coach Miller has done with the women. It's a TEAM mentality, where every player, even the star, is secondary to the team. That is how you create a championship program. And that's what Blasi has done at Miami. And what Jon Wooden did at UCLA. And what Krzyzewski has done at Duke.

I love these "BG kind of player posts".

[Globetrotter]

I think presuming that an 18 year old kid has a fragile mindset is kind of odd...besides, I don't think the coach should alter his decisions on PT based on hurt feelings. It's a simple process...contribute to wins or sit. Better to learn that as an 18 year-old freshman than a 22 year-old senior.

Kind of odd? You were 18, imagine when you were 18 and having extreme highs followed by extreme lows. Imagine being a star basketball player and blocked off from facing lots of consequences and then having expectations really high and then crushed. Ignoring the mindset of an 18 year old, which is going to be fragile is not a good idea. Do you really think that an 18 year old who sees his PT pulled really sees it as a simple process of I am not contributing so I should sit. Like I said prior his first inclination will be inward because it will hurt. It will hurt anyone to have PT pulled. Ideally as you state it is a learning experience and he gets better. I am not saying you have to let him keep playing, what I am saying is that you realize he is an 18 year old and this might be a tough situation for him.

I agree with your second point. It just needs to be addressed with the player and I would bet that Coach Orr is smart enough to do that.