Omar Jacobs Cbs.sportsline.com 2006 Draft

1987alum · Post by **1987alum** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 1:49 pm

transfer2BGSU wrote:Why does that shock you? Because he was a Heisman Trophy winner?

There was a certain Heisman Trophy winner from a school we played this past fall that wasn't even drafted.

True. And what if, for some reason, the Giants or the 49ers end up with the first pick? Unless Manning or Smith had a career-ending injury, that is...

hammb · Post by **hammb** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 2:49 pm

1987alum wrote:
transfer2BGSU wrote:Why does that shock you? Because he was a Heisman Trophy winner?

There was a certain Heisman Trophy winner from a school we played this past fall that wasn't even drafted.
True. And what if, for some reason, the Giants or the 49ers end up with the first pick? Unless Manning or Smith had a career-ending injury, that is...

Barring anything unforeseen (injury or sudden struggles) Leinhart will be #1 overall regardless. He would've been #1 overall this season by a landslide. I don't care what happens in the NFL Leinhart will be the #1 pick, and whoever is lucky enough to earn that pick will make a FORTUNE in pawning it off to some team in need of a QB.

That kid is seen as a surefire star at the NFL. He's got everything any coach/GM could ever ask for and he combines it with an impeccable record on the field as well. He's surrounded by stars, yes, but he makes those stars shine even brighter. I was apprehensive of him, but after seeing him play a couple games I think he probably is the real deal.

Any mock draft for '06, as ludicrous as they are anyway, is full of it if they don't think he goes #1 overall. That has nothing to do with his winning a Heisman or a national championship. It has everything to do with how NFL talent guys have been drooling over him since this past year. He passed up the #1 pick this year to go back to school. He'll be #1 next year if he stays healthy.

1987alum · Post by **1987alum** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 2:54 pm

hammb:

I was going to argue with you, then thought it out ...

Let's say that the Giants flame out and wind up with the #1 pick. Do they pick Leinart? No, they don't. [ I got this far in my addled thought process when I was about to respond to your post. Inexplicably, I kept thinking ...]

They trade out of the top spot to some QB-hungry team ... hello, Mr. Saban, just back the truck up to the door. Thus Leinart is #1.

Or they pull a San Diego and actually pick the kid ... then trade him to a QB-hungry team ... yes Mr. Saban, a bunch of draft picks and money will suit us just fine.

[at this point, my anemic thought process ran out of steam, so feel free to pick it apart if I missed something]

Warthog · Post by **Warthog** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 2:59 pm

Or the G-men just take Leinart and show Eli the door after he leads them to a season that results in them having the worst record in the league.

hammb · Post by **hammb** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 3:07 pm

Exactly right '87.

Leinart is seen, right now anyways, as a prospect on par with Manning or Vick. Anytime there is a surefire #1 QB they end up going #1. Sure the original team may trade down (ala SD trading Vick to Atlanta), but in the end that top notch QB prospect is the #1 pick.

kdog27 · Post by **kdog27** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 7:58 pm

After seeing how much Omar has improved with his deep passes at the spring game, another statistical season like last year should get him a top 5 spot without any problem. If he is aleady in some people's top 5 he will be in everyone't top 5 with a follow up year.

Germainfitch1 · Post by **Germainfitch1** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:06 pm

hammb wrote:Exactly right '87.

Leinart is seen, right now anyways, as a prospect on par with Manning or Vick. Anytime there is a surefire #1 QB they end up going #1. Sure the original team may trade down (ala SD trading Vick to Atlanta), but in the end that top notch QB prospect is the #1 pick.

I am going to need to disagree here just because next year will be a little dirfferent then most. A QB has been drafted first in like 8 of hte last 9 years so it is very probable that Leinart goes first but there was some real talent that returened last year that will get long looks. D'Brickashaw Ferguson for one. If he continues to improve and is a lights out Ogden like pick a team like the Browns or Giants could hold on to that number one over all pick aand take Ferguson. If you have a gaping hole at LT and the 2nd overall pick does too you wont very well be able to trade down. It is not often that a talent like Ferguson returns. Its also not often that a talent like Leinar returns. Currently he is recovering from surgery on his shoulder. If things dont go perfectly well we could be looking at a LT going first no matter what. With that said there are several ifs there, I just wanted to point out that it is unlikely but not impossible.

BGFalcons232 · Post by **BGFalcons232** » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:13 pm

there's about 3 or 4 real good LT's in the 2006 draft. ferguson is just one of a few who can realistically go top 5. ferguson, jon scott out of texas, and eric winston from miami will all go high as OT's. marcus mcneil out of auburn is another real good OT. a team could trade out of the #1 overall spot and get a very good OT anywhere in the top 10-12 in the draft.

the number of OT's in next year's draft is why i'm perplexed as to why d'brickashaw stayed at virginia.

Germainfitch1 · Post by **Germainfitch1** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 12:54 am

hammb wrote:Exactly right '87.

Leinart is seen, right now anyways, as a prospect on par with Manning or Vick. Anytime there is a surefire #1 QB they end up going #1. Sure the original team may trade down (ala SD trading Vick to Atlanta), but in the end that top notch QB prospect is the #1 pick.

Leinart is not on par with Vick or Manning. Manning if you remember was a questioned first overall pick by many temas and gurus who felt that Ryan Leaf was the next Elway.

In fact Carson Palmer was a much much higher rated prospect than Leinart is. Leinart was the number one pick in this draft but it was a very very weak QB draft.

Flipper · Post by **Flipper** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 7:54 am

It's hard to compare Vick and Leinart ( or Manning) because he's such a freak. It's too much of an aplles/oranges comparison. I think Leinart would have gone ahead of Manning had they been in the same draft.

Who's going to need a QB next year ? Detroit may be willing to pull the plug on Joey (there was talk that they were going to do it this year after June 1st) Baltimore may finally realize that Kyle Boller isn't an NFL QB.
Tampa Bay and Miami come to mind also. Who else is there?

hammb · Post by **hammb** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 8:46 am

I certainly was not comparing Vick to Leinart in terms of playing style. I was merely stating that they were both seen as surefire top QB prospects.

As for Peyton, he WAS a very highly regarded prospect. He would've been the #1 overall pick had he left after his Jr year, when the the Jets had the #1 and needed a QB. There was a lot of speculation that he didn't want to play there, and that played a factor in him returning. Then Leaf blew up his Jr year and caught up with Peyton. The only reason why Peyton wasn't a surefire lock at #1 was because there were two legit top QB prospects. Obviously one didn't pan out, but they were both rated higher than a lot of prospects who have gone #1 since then.

As for Leinart -vs- Carson Palmer, you're the first person I've EVER heard say that Palmer is/was rated higher as a prospect. Palmer had a great senior season but had done very little up until that point. Leinart has now had 2 seasons that were every bit as good, if not better, than Palmer's. I've always heard just the opposite, that Leinart was a much better prospect in most people's eyes.

Flipper, teams that might be looking to go QB next year that might also be picking towards the top of the draft could be: Arizona, Tennessee, Detroit, Tampa Bay, Miami, and Dallas. I wouldn't be shocked to see KC, New Orleans, or Carolina looking for a QB of the future either.

My point is that when teams want a QB a guy like Leinart will go #1. Somebody, if they don't have the #1 pick, will give up a LOT to get that #1 pick to get their guy.

Flipper · Post by **Flipper** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 9:06 am

I think it's hard to compare Vick to Leinart as a qb prospect because Vick was the kind of talent that potentially redefines his position. A guy like Leinart comes a long and you look at him in the context of your system and personnel. A guy like Vick comes along and you take a more transcendental view of things. You begin to think of ways you can alter your system to match his talents. I do agree that Leinart is equal to or better as a prospect than Palmer or Eli Manning

I don't think KC, Carolina, Detroit or Tennessee would be willing to spend the picks and cap space needed to get Leinart. I don't know if Bill Parcells would be either. I don't see Dallas being awful enough to be that high in the draft.

I could see Arizona, Tampa Bay, Miami and possibly New Orleans having the need and being lousy enough overall to warrant spending the $$$ on a franchise QB. Arizona thinks they have a playoff team in the making....I'll believe it when I see it.

Germainfitch1 · Post by **Germainfitch1** » Thu Apr 28, 2005 9:16 am

hammb wrote:I certainly was not comparing Vick to Leinart in terms of playing style. I was merely stating that they were both seen as surefire top QB prospects.

As for Peyton, he WAS a very highly regarded prospect. He would've been the #1 overall pick had he left after his Jr year, when the the Jets had the #1 and needed a QB. There was a lot of speculation that he didn't want to play there, and that played a factor in him returning. Then Leaf blew up his Jr year and caught up with Peyton. The only reason why Peyton wasn't a surefire lock at #1 was because there were two legit top QB prospects. Obviously one didn't pan out, but they were both rated higher than a lot of prospects who have gone #1 since then.

As for Leinart -vs- Carson Palmer, you're the first person I've EVER heard say that Palmer is/was rated higher as a prospect. Palmer had a great senior season but had done very little up until that point. Leinart has now had 2 seasons that were every bit as good, if not better, than Palmer's. I've always heard just the opposite, that Leinart was a much better prospect in most people's eyes.

Flipper, teams that might be looking to go QB next year that might also be picking towards the top of the draft could be: Arizona, Tennessee, Detroit, Tampa Bay, Miami, and Dallas. I wouldn't be shocked to see KC, New Orleans, or Carolina looking for a QB of the future either.

My point is that when teams want a QB a guy like Leinart will go #1. Somebody, if they don't have the #1 pick, will give up a LOT to get that #1 pick to get their guy.

Carson Palmer is as complete of a NFL QB prospect as you can get. He was a top recruit since his HS days. If you think college production equates to being a top prospect please call Tommy Cheng and Jason White and let them know. Jason White should be waiting by his phone so it should not be a problem to reach him.

hammb · Post by **hammb** » Thu Apr 28, 2005 9:56 am

Germainfitch1 wrote:
Carson Palmer is as complete of a NFL QB prospect as you can get. He was a top recruit since his HS days. If you think college production equates to being a top prospect please call Tommy Cheng and Jason White and let them know. Jason White should be waiting by his phone so it should not be a problem to reach him.

He was a top notch HS recruit who had a pretty promising freshman season. He then had 2 VERY disappointing years as a So & Jr. He then had a breakout year as a senior and won the Heisman.

That is not the point of what I'm saying.

I'm not basing anything on college numbers or what have you. If its me grading them I'd knock Leinart down 3 rounds, because I don't draft a left handed QB, but I'm not an NFL scout (with good reason).

I'm merely stating what I've read in the past.

Not as steadfast as I remembered reading but here's one draft writeup saying, "junior QB Matt Leinart is already considered by some to be a better prospect that former USC Carson Palmer, the first player picked at the 2003 draft, and will likely be a top pick himself if he enters this year's draft"

http://www.gbnreport.com/2004Top25.htm

That was written BEFORE the 2004 season.

Since Leinart ended up returning to school, I'm having a hard time finding more links that compare the two. I know that I found it to be common thinking that Leinart was the better prospect when it was believed he would be leaving early. I'm sure it will all be rehashed when Leinart does enter the draft next season.

I don't know about stats or whatever, but I'm certain most draft publications I've read have held steadfast that Leinart is a better prospect than Palmer was considered.

Germainfitch1 · Post by **Germainfitch1** » Thu Apr 28, 2005 11:58 am

So you are certain but you have no proof?

Well you won me over.

These draft publications as a rule error on the side of the ridiculously sensational. Every one is "the next" or a "better prospect then"