Stover?

[BelieveNBG]

<<1. Big game preparations . . . I felt we did an absolute p*ss poor job of preparing for Ohio State and little changed my mind at Oklahoma. Rather than being happy to be in the game, why not go into the game with the opinion of Fresno State, Boise State and yes Utah and EXPECT to win rather than being content to COMPETE. >>

The team was prepared to go in and win against OSU and OU. This was evident in conversations with the players. Prior to the OU game, there wasn't a player that would have said they couldn't beat OU. This belief that they could win the game came directly from the coaches and film study to show these guys just how OU could be beat. Of course, you would never make those comments in a press conference, because there is no need to add any fire to the opposing team, but you better believe that BG went to OU to WIN, not just compete. Even after the game, the players were shown " why they didn't win" and not told "Great game guys...we came close.

<<Throw out 1950's logic of a depth chart being mostly/or at least partially based on seniority. GET THE ATHLETES ON THE FIELD . . . Raishaun Stover, Dan Macon, Corey Partridge, etc, etc, etc . . . are FOOTBALL players . . . You find ways to use them and you find ways to get people like COLE MAGNER and JAMES HAWKINS the ball . . . >>

In most cases the upper classmen are the better players. The reason is due to size, strength, and knowledge. Sometimes a younger athelete may have more skills, but the player isn't strong enough or mentally ready to put it all together on the field. Also, don't forget, many of those upper classmen that are playing were pretty darn good atheletes coming out of high school too. They are D1 players for a reason. A player like Corey may be a great athelete, but why waste his freshman year when we have one of the top receiving corps in the nation.

In the end, whether we beat OU or not, doesn't change our destiny. The rest of our schedule is so bleak (I say this based on the rankings of our upcoming opponents) that even if we run the tables, we will still get the same outcome, a MAC title, GMAC or MCB, and alot of respect for having only 1 loss.

GO BG!!!

[hammb]

<<1. Big game preparations . . . I felt we did an absolute p*ss poor job of preparing for Ohio State and little changed my mind at Oklahoma. Rather than being happy to be in the game, why not go into the game with the opinion of Fresno State, Boise State and yes Utah and EXPECT to win rather than being content to COMPETE. >>

The team was prepared to go in and win against OSU and OU. This was evident in conversations with the players. Prior to the OU game, there wasn't a player that would have said they couldn't beat OU. This belief that they could win the game came directly from the coaches and film study to show these guys just how OU could be beat. Of course, you would never make those comments in a press conference, because there is no need to add any fire to the opposing team, but you better believe that BG went to OU to WIN, not just compete. Even after the game, the players were shown " why they didn't win" and not told "Great game guys...we came close.

Option's problem is different than what you're addressing, and I saw the same thing in both games. Mentally, you are correct, they are prepared and they do believe they can win. Rightfully so.

However, the playcalling in both the OSU & OU game does not show a confidence that the coaches think we can win the games. In both the OSU & OU games our offense was run with the decision to not screw up. If you look back at the flow of those 2 games they were surprisingly similar. We ran a good semblance of our offense early and in both games we put points up early. Then we went into a shell and in both games the offense disappeared for most of the 2nd & 3rd quarters. Then, after we were down we opened things up and put enough points on the board to make it a game again. In both instances we fell short.

Option and I agree whole-heartedly on this fact that our coaching staff played both games close to the vest in the hopes of keeping our defense off the field. Unfortunately, in doing so they neutralized our greatest strength: Our OFFENSE. Look back at those game films and the number of times we went downfield is minimal. You cannot run a spread offense without taking some shots downfield. Once the defense knows you're running nothing but 5 yard routes they creep their zone in tight, and there are no longer any holes in it. You absolutely HAVE to go over the top. It is clear, in both games, that our coaching staff did not have confidence in our OL's ability to protect the QB, and all of the pass plays were quick hitters until we were down big.

I think our coaching staff is quite adequate, and they are definitely focused on winning the MAC. However, I will not be happy until BGSU football is in a position to be a perennial top 20 team. Until we start to run a more normal game plan, rather than protecting against blowouts, we will not beat these teams. We had the firepower to put points up on OSU. OU would've been a tougher matter as they could bounce right back and score on us at will as well, but OSU didn't have that capability. I like our coaches, but I still think they could do a better job playcalling/gameplanning for the matchups against the top programs in the NCAA.

[BelieveNBG]

You are absolutely right. We did not take enough shots down field and the offense stalled so often that the defense was on the field for 40 minutes. I was very frustrated during that game because we did not open it up. Many of us in attendance were complaining about us not taking shots at our elite receivers, such as getting the ball out to a Chuck and taking advantage of his abilities. Throwing down field more often would have allowed Cole more opportunities to receive the ball on slants without all the heavy traffic. Instead, the plays were tentative.

Why is the question? In the case of the OU game, I believe the coaches did not want to do anything that could mess with Omar's confidense and screw him up for the rest of the year. I think they were more concerned with keeping him physically and mentally tough for the MAC road ahead. I believe the coaches thought we could win, as long as, we didn't make too many mistakes. Realistically, we should have played to score as many points as possible, that way, the team with the most points wins. Not the team with the least errors wins. I believe we were more than capable of putting up more than 40 points. Heck, we took one deep shot down the field to Chuck, it looked very good, and he didn't reel it in. Problem is, we didn't go back again. I know Chuck would not have missed another one due to sheer determination and we didn't give him the chance to make it up.

As for OSU, I believe our players lacked confidence and the plays that were called were not successfully executed. J5 struggled quite a bit that game, until the last quarter when we reallized we could move the ball against their defense.

As for next year, we better go into Wisconsin playing like we expect to win and opening up our offense, if we plan to come out with a W. I would hope that is our plan and not to just compete. The coaches did a great job selling the "We can win" theory to the players. Now, they need to sell it to themselves.

[hammb]

The coaches did a great job selling the "We can win" theory to the players. Now, they need to sell it to themselves.

Option & I's entire argument summed up in 2 sentences. Good job.

[OptionQB]

Brian,

I owe you a beer! Thank you for your support and providing logic . . . This is a Raishaun Stover thread and I didn't mean to rant, but it seemed to flow with the rest of the conversation and my thoughts at the time.

The offense we ran at Ohio State was a timid, scared, please don't hurt us offense. The offense at OU was . . . we don't want to get blown out . . . But worse than the offense was the defensive playing at OU . . . I realize that at some point you have to have athletes similar to K-State and LSU to run similar schemes . . .

Maybe not across the board, but if Marshall and Fresno State can be them in Manhattan, then at SOME positions and in the past few classes in particular . . . WE HAVE SOME K-STATE LEVEL ATHLETES . . . I will fight to the end to prove that . . .

K-State and LSU blitz until they were blue in the face and forced White into making rushed decisions and testing his mobility. If you're willing to put Jelani Jordan and Terrill Mayberry in man coverage against the best collection of talent in the NCAAs then you have to trust that they can make plays . . . If you don't have that confidence, find someone else . . .

The Corey Partridge comments were taken slightly off-base as well . . . I wasn't talking about why didn't Corey play offense at Oklahoma . . . Sorry, we have 19 guys listed at WR . . . Using a team concept and looking at the obvious holes we have . . . One can easily see we have depth issues at LB and CB . . . Why in the world the offensive coaches get the first option on a kid with his athletic ability when the defense could clearly use him is beyond me. Our defensive backs need to be more physical and we need more of them.

Other than the sentiment that hammb left us with . . . I just wonder why we play it so close to the vest with OSU and OU and we'll open it up against a team that arguably had the most firepower to blow us out (Remember the playing calling in West Lafayette, Brian?) . . .

That being said, we can get great recruits every year, but until we beat one of the "big" boys we won't be considered among them . . . It's nice to get a check for $500,000, but it's much nicer to be able to go into a kid's living room and say "Last year we beat Oklahoma . . . In the 4 years you'll be at Bowling Green, you'll have the same opportunities against Wisconsin, Boise, Arizona State, Virginia Tech and possibly Ohio State if we need to redshirt you"

[hammb]

Other than the sentiment that hammb left us with . . . I just wonder why we play it so close to the vest with OSU and OU and we'll open it up against a team that arguably had the most firepower to blow us out (Remember the playing calling in West Lafayette, Brian?) . . .

Remember it vividly. We played that game to freaking WIN! If Charles Sharon drops that final pass, or J5 is sacked, no real complaints from me. We played a game plan with some downfield throws and were trying to win. Right from the get-go with the skinny post that Hawkins turned into a 90 yarder we were going downfield more than we did at either OSU or OU.

I also seem to recall a good number of blitzes to get some pressure on Orton. It almost resulted in disaster if Stubblefield (I think?) reels in that one pass where he made Patton eat his jock, but I still think that you have to take some chances in order to win these sorts of games.

We are to the point where we can run OUR offensive scheme with our offensive players against any defense in the country and put up points. However, against the elite defenses we've played we looked afraid to try for fear that we make some turnovers and lose the game.

There is no doubt that OSU & OU have 2 of the best defenses in college football, but that is no reason to annoint them as such before we test our mettle against 'em.

[Warthog]

I think the conservative play calling against OU was more a factor of Omar making his first start than being intimidated by their defense. IMO. That said, I would agree that the play calling (was it the game plan? ) against TOSU last year left very little to the imagination. With an experienced QB like Harris under canter leading our offense, I wish we would have played more of our style of football than let them dictate would we should try.

[hammb]

I think the conservative play calling against OU was more a factor of Omar making his first start than being intimidated by their defense. IMO. That said, I would agree that the play calling (was it the game plan? ) against TOSU last year left very little to the imagination. With an experienced QB like Harris under canter leading our offense, I wish we would have played more of our style of football than let them dictate would we should try.

I agree that Omar's first start might have had something to do with it. As many of you know I was more pessimistic than most about his first start at OU. Its asking a lot ot play Oklahoma in your first collegiate start. So fine, play it close to the vest. In all seriousness though about 1 quarter in it became clear that Omar has "IT" I don't know what "IT" is, and neither do most coaches, but I know "IT" when I see it, and I'm thinking that Omar has "IT"

I liken it to Rocky II against Apollo. Start off fighting Right handed, but once you prove that you can stay in the ring (or on the field) with him, switch back to your natural southpaw ways and win the fight in the end! It didn't take 12 rounds for us, it was clear that we could play with OU about 1 quarter in.

[Cork]

We're deep at RB. Its amazing. Pope is a proven player, and I think you guys underrate Lane. Coming into this season, he averaged 6.4 yards per carry, and that's a pretty good track record.

And he can catch also, perhaps that's a difference to playtime.

Then again, it might be a good time during the season to single out players and have at 'em.

[Warthog]

I think the conservative play calling against OU was more a factor of Omar making his first start than being intimidated by their defense. IMO. That said, I would agree that the play calling (was it the game plan? ) against TOSU last year left very little to the imagination. With an experienced QB like Harris under canter leading our offense, I wish we would have played more of our style of football than let them dictate would we should try.

I agree that Omar's first start might have had something to do with it. As many of you know I was more pessimistic than most about his first start at OU. Its asking a lot ot play Oklahoma in your first collegiate start. So fine, play it close to the vest. In all seriousness though about 1 quarter in it became clear that Omar has "IT" I don't know what "IT" is, and neither do most coaches, but I know "IT" when I see it, and I'm thinking that Omar has "IT"

I liken it to Rocky II against Apollo. Start off fighting Right handed, but once you prove that you can stay in the ring (or on the field) with him, switch back to your natural southpaw ways and win the fight in the end! It didn't take 12 rounds for us, it was clear that we could play with OU about 1 quarter in.

I hope having "IT" is a good thing.

And congrats on becoming a fledgling.

[hammb]

I hope having "IT" is a good thing.

And congrats on becoming a fledgling.

"IT" is a good thing

And I hadn't even noticed my fledgling status! Sweet! Things finally quieting down at work so I at least have time for this website if not others.

[kdog27]

Other than the sentiment that hammb left us with . . . I just wonder why we play it so close to the vest with OSU and OU and we'll open it up against a team that arguably had the most firepower to blow us out (Remember the playing calling in West Lafayette, Brian?) . . .

Remember it vividly. We played that game to freaking WIN! If Charles Sharon drops that final pass, or J5 is sacked, no real complaints from me. We played a game plan with some downfield throws and were trying to win. Right from the get-go with the skinny post that Hawkins turned into a 90 yarder we were going downfield more than we did at either OSU or OU.

I also seem to recall a good number of blitzes to get some pressure on Orton. It almost resulted in disaster if Stubblefield (I think?) reels in that one pass where he made Patton eat his jock, but I still think that you have to take some chances in order to win these sorts of games.

We are to the point where we can run OUR offensive scheme with our offensive players against any defense in the country and put up points. However, against the elite defenses we've played we looked afraid to try for fear that we make some turnovers and lose the game.

There is no doubt that OSU & OU have 2 of the best defenses in college football, but that is no reason to annoint them as such before we test our mettle against 'em.

I am also a firm believer that we did not play the OSU and OU games to win. We played them to stay in it and not get blown out IMO. Of the two, OSU was by far the more winnable game. After watching the Purdue game I was very confident that we would go into the shoe and pass all over them and play BG football. At purdue they kept the defense on their heels by using Harris as a mobile option. He had numerous designed runs in that game and anyone who saw that game would agree that by the fourth quarter we had worn the Purdue defense down, especially the d line. Purdue caught a break by intercepting that pass (which really wasn't caught). But everything ended up ok. Against OSU they took his feet away from. If memory serves me correctly Harris did not have a single play where he took the ball on a draw. We played three and out football for the second and third quarters, with the excpetion of the drive where we should have scored. If this game was coached like the Purdue game, I believe we would have scored a lot more.
Like you guys have said, it is a little more acceptable against OU because it was Jacobs first game. However, you still have to let him throw it down field. He had two semi deep passes in the first half, the one where he scrambled away and found sharon in the EZ and the play where Sharon just missed a wide open catch. Both were good plays. I think things should have been opened up a lot more after Jacobs got his first td pass and had some confidence. Keeping OU's offense off the field as Brandon put being a key to the second half only works if you give yourself an oppurtunity to move the ball. It wasn't until the end of the 3rd quarter that we gave our offense the plays to do it. I would much rather go three and out and take some shots down the field than get one first down throwing 4 yd passes and then punt. Your not giving yourself a fair chance by playing scared (or to keep the other team off the field). I love Brandon and all, but I hated his quote to begin the second half. What type of confidence does that give the D? he is basically saying that our only shot to win is to score. eh

[Flipper]

We played them both to win. When you face an opponent who has more talent than you, your best bet is to try and hang around and hope for some breaks at the end. It almost worked that way at OSU. We were within TWO PLAYS of winning that game.

It didn't work as well against OU, but it was still the strategery that provided us with the best oportunity to succeed.

[hammb]

We played them both to win. When you face an opponent who has more talent than you, your best bet is to try and hang around and hope for some breaks at the end. It almost worked that way at OSU. We were within TWO PLAYS of winning that game.

It didn't work as well against OU, but it was still the strategery that provided us with the best oportunity to succeed.

So you're willing to admit that there is no way we can win if we play Falcon Football? I'm not so willing to admit that. I've seen plenty of upsets in recent years where teams go out & play their game. In fact I have seen way more games where the underdog comes in and plays there game and makes plays all game long than I have where someone "hang[s] around and hope[s] for some breaks at the end"

I think that is a strategy that admits you don't believe you can possibly win if you play your game. I also think that its a strategy destined for failure. One thing about these more talented teams is that they know how to make the plays at the end of a game to win it. The last thing you want is to be within 7 points (either way) of OSU at the end of a game, because they'll WIN it! Look at their record in close games. In order to win that game we had to come out and play the entire game with OUR gameplan, not some keep it close mentality. Call them the luckeyes, call them good, call them well coached, I don't care; but the fact is that OSU wins on a weekly basis in close games.

You equate keeping it close in the big games to playing to win, I do not. I don't think we played to win at OU, and I definitely didn't think we did last year at OSU. If we continue to play these games to keep it close and hope for breaks you can bet we won't be winning one any time soon either. Its a poor strategy, and one that relies on a superior team screwing up. Worse yet it neutralizes our best asset...offense.

[BGSUfanatUT]

It was clear we weren't trying to win at osu last year, we played BG football for abotu 2 possesions of that entire game....